lil rumor

[ford832]

Yes ford, please post the actual comparisons from all manufacturers of reliablity.  I'm sure there are magazine articles etc.  Not just joe smoes opinions. Actual comparisons professionally done.

As you well know I can't do that simply because,to my knowledge,it's never been done.
What I did instead,to be fair,as I was waiting between paint coats,was to go to the mag stack and pick the first few MXA's with Honda tests to pick a few tidbits out.In the case of the 99 I had to dig down though as I wanted a 2t test.Admittedly,the stack isn't what it used be as a few years ago in a fit o f"the walls are closing in and some of this sh!t has got to go" I gave away all of them except those with tests of bikes I'd had-nostalgic reason I suppose,so most of mine are recent.Anyway........

[SachsGS]

A friend of mine served the first year and a half of his automotive technician apprenticeship in a Honda dealership replacing a defective part in Honda Accord automatic transmissions.Day in and day out he did this and he almost suffered a nervous breakdown.Every Honda Accord imported into Canada during this era was defective and rather then issue a recall Honda set about quietly contacting the owners and repairing their automobiles before they blew up.I never read about this in the media.

The first 1800 V4 500 Honda streetbikes imported into North America in the early 80's had misaligned crankshaft journals and would fracture the crankshafts when started.

A friend of mine has a nieghbour whose son is sponsored by Honda on a CRF250 and in his first spring of racing had four bikes blow their countershafts in the span of a month or two.

Honda cars? I once changed a motor in my sister in law's Honda (blew a frost plug).My hands were cut to ribbons because Honda was too cheap to deburr all the sharp edges in the engine compartment.I'd rather drive a Hyundai then a Honda.

[ford832]

Ford, I'm one of those who believes my 2002-07 chassis 2 strokes were the best handling bikes I've ever owned.  If you know anything about me, you know I've owned well over a couple hundred bikes, since that is what I do. My bikes do ruts better than any bike I've ridden. I could never go in, gas it, and hope to keep the front end inside without feeling like I was gonna fall. These bikes handle perfectly.

Granted,this is an 02 test and refers to previous,but it is a Honda after all.
MXA 2002 CR250

Question Three.How does the 2002 CR250 run?

It has a flat powerband.It comes on with a muffled sensation,surges in the middle,then trails off.


Question Six. Does the CR tranny shift?

No,it's stiff,cranky and reluctant.We were shocked at how notchy the CR250 tranny felt.


Question Eight.What about the suspension?

Oh happy days,Never has the word excellent been used in conjunction with Honda CR250 suspension.Honda owns the intellectual rights to the phrase "mid stroke harshness" Whether we are talking about the old steel frame CR's or the new aluminum twin spar units,Honda has had bad suspension.It has been traditional,like turkey at thanksgiving or bad tatoos on freestylers,for Hondas to have teeth shattering front forks.No more.The 2002 CR250 suspension is the best Honda suspension we have ever tested.Ever!It actually works.It goes up and down without jarring your eye teeth,pounding your forearms or making you pull in on lap four complaining of double vision.Hallelujah!

Rating

In our opinion,the new chassis is a step up in fit and feel,but not much of an improvement in cornering prowess.We still rate the 93 geometry as the best ever,with the current model somewhere between the 94 and 01 specs.

[ford832]

A friend of mine served the first year and a half of his automotive technician apprenticeship in a Honda dealership replacing a defective part in Honda Accord automatic transmissions.Day in and day out he did this and he almost suffered a nervous breakdown.Every Honda Accord imported into Canada during this era was defective and rather then issue a recall Honda set about quietly contacting the owners and repairing their automobiles before they blew up.I never read about this in the media.

The first 1800 V4 500 Honda streetbikes imported into North America in the early 80's had misaligned crankshaft journals and would fracture the crankshafts when started.

A friend of mine has a nieghbour whose son is sponsored by Honda on a CRF250 and in his first spring of racing had four bikes blow their countershafts in the span of a month or two.

Honda cars? I once changed a motor in my sister in law's Honda (blew a frost plug).My hands were cut to ribbons because Honda was too cheap to deburr all the sharp edges in the engine compartment.I'd rather drive a Hyundai then a Honda.

You lie.Honda's couldn't possible be that way.Bite your tongue. I had a 750 Interceptor with cam issues as well but those were due to undersized oil passages/too little flow to the top end.Honda would warranty the cams if they fell within the warranty period one time but this never fixed the problem.The next time you were on your own.Your buddies story reminds me of why I won't work in a dealership-too much repetitive,mind numbing warranty work.

[ford832]

99 CR125-Fifth place and sinking fast.

Power.

Poor.How the mighty have fallen.The CR125 line never had any low end,but it used to have a ripping good top end.No more.Bad jetting,confused rev and an assortment of snaps,crackles and pops are all this mid range only engine delivers.

Shifting

Fair.The combination of a 5 speed and a short powerband have seriously damaged the previously excellent CR shifting.Lots of missed shifts.

Shock

Poor.This is a bike that hates choppy bumps.It goes kack,kack,kack over acceleration bumps.The stock spring rate is good, but the the shock is not responsive on high speed compression.

Handling

Fair.It's easy to blame the aluminum frame for the CR125's handling ills,but that's not fair.Even the steel framed CR's felt like they were designed by a committee.This is a busy bike with lots of pitch correction-which exhibits itself with unexpected push out of the front end.

[ford832]

2011 CRF 250-Fifth place

Handling: The MXA wrecking crew will describe the handling of the 2011 CRF250 with our  rose colored glasses on.If you aren't afraid of massive headshake down straights and can live with a front end that tucks under in tight turns,then you will love the CRF250.That is,if you can stop the bike from submarining into the ground.

The word: The 2011 Honda CRF250 finished last in MXA's 250 shootout for three reasons.The engine is far too mellow,the frame geometry is scary,and the suspension is poorly set up.

[2smoker]

It will be good to see Honda with a new 2 stroke in 2012.. because everybody else will follow! BTW.. I cannot wait to see if KTM will finally going into production with a full FI 2 stroke next year? Can we say sold out?

[ford832]

2010 CRF450

Q:How fast is the 2010 CRF450?
A: It's not very fast.In fact,it is the slowest bike we have tested in 2010.There is no shame in that though because Honda's goal was to make the CRF450 easier to ride-and it is.The herky-jerky throttle response off idle has been seriously reduced,and the engine revs slower,which makes the powerband feel broader.For followers of the "450's are too powerful" crowd,Honda has built the perfect engine.

Q:What did we hate?
A: Clutch.Yikes!This is barely a clutch.With only four clutch springs,the CRF450 clutch has the lifespan of a gypsy moth.


I've got more but that's it for me.My arthritic fingers are knotting up and I've got work to do.You get the idea-hopefully.

[snook620]

Ford, every car/motorcycle/engine manufacturer in the world has had problems and recalls. It doesnt matter if its a Lambo or a Kia....everybody has problems. Look at all the Toyota recalls last year, they made a mistake and it was corrected. It doesnt mean Toyota's quality has went down. I want to see links were someone has done comparisions on reliability and found Hondas unreliable. Google "Whats the most reliable used car" and I guarentee Honda will be at the top of those lists.

A friend of mine has a nieghbour whose son is sponsored by Honda on a CRF250 and in his first spring of racing had four bikes blow their countershafts in the span of a month or two.

I didnt know countershafts can blow? Are you talking about the sprocket or the actual shaft 

Honda cars? I once changed a motor in my sister in law's Honda (blew a frost plug).My hands were cut to ribbons because Honda was too cheap to deburr all the sharp edges in the engine compartment.I'd rather drive a Hyundai then a Honda.

Sounds like your sister in law should have put a little antifreeze in her coolant like it says in the manual.

I'd be interested in your age and qualifications.I like to know who I'm talking to.

  I dont know why every time I disagree with someone on here it turns into a 6 page debate. Im 31, no Im not an ASE certified mechanic. Does that mean your right and Im wrong? No.

[ford832]

Ford, every car/motorcycle/engine manufacturer in the world has had problems and recalls. It doesnt matter if its a Lambo or a Kia....everybody has problems. Look at all the Toyota recalls last year, they made a mistake and it was corrected. It doesnt mean Toyota's quality has went down. I want to see links were someone has done comparisions on reliability and found Hondas unreliable. Google "Whats the most reliable used car" and I guarentee Honda will be at the top of those lists.

I agree,and I never once said they weren't or that others don't have issues.All I said was that they have issues like everyone else.As soon as you mention something like that to a Honda guy,it's like waving a red flag in front of a bull.Honestly,I've never found fans of other brands to be that way-it always struck me as bizarre.As per my previous post,Honda is #3 of my top 3-that's not bad.
BTW,brag up your Honda 4t mower all you want-I've got a 16 yr old 2t lawn boy that gets used hard and often,starts first pull and has so far cost me exactly 2 spark plugs that I just changed because I figured I should.Two strokes rule!!!  

[TMKIWI]

Honda fans are a bit like like Maico fans.
Seriously the hole debate started when someone sugested that Hondas reliability reputation was not warranted.
I agree.
Fact 1: Honda make some good bikes & cars.
Fact 2: Honda have made some pigs.
Fact 3: Honda have been one of the worst manufactors that will never admit fault or admit they got it wrong.
I dont believe Honda are any better or worse then any other manufactor.
If humans are involved anywhere in the production, things will go wrong.

Honda's reputation was built when you were comparing Honda's with Triumph/Norton.
Was not a fair comparison was it.
They have been living on it ever since.

[ford832]

  I dont know why every time I disagree with someone on here it turns into a 6 page debate. Im 31, no Im not an ASE certified mechanic. Does that mean your right and Im wrong? No.

It probably turns in to a 6 pg debate because you post too many things that are wrong  
And no,certification means diddly in many cases,it simply proves that I've seen far more than many casual types,so therefore have a strong basis for my opinions.The reason I'm not brand loyal for anything is because I've seen far too many issues on everything-including Honda-despite what some would have you believe.

[ford832]

Honda fans are a bit like like Maico fans.
Seriously the hole debate started when someone sugested that Hondas reliability reputation was not warranted.
I agree.
Fact 1: Honda make some good bikes & cars.
Fact 2: Honda have made some pigs.
Fact 3: Honda have been one of the worst manufactors that will never admit fault or admit they got it wrong.
I dont believe Honda are any better or worse then any other manufactor.
If humans are involved anywhere in the production, things will go wrong.

Honda's reputation was built when you were comparing Honda's with Triumph/Norton.
Was not a fair comparison was it.
They have been living on it ever since.

I agree with all of the above.It's funny you mention the Triumph/Norton thing .As I was aimlessly painting along I was thinking their reputation as being so much better likely came from their early days when they killed the Brits as I couldn't think of another point in time that would warrant it.
I guess great minds think alike-or fools seldom differ.

[TMKIWI]

Fools probably.

My fathers generation grew up riding british bike and when Honda came on the scene it was a big deal.
Even today they are big Honda fans just because of it.
Everytime you have a few beers with them they go on & on about it. Yes guys, But that was 40 years ago.

[snook620]

It probably turns in to a 6 pg debate because you post too many things that are wrong  
And no,certification means diddly in many cases,it simply proves that I've seen far more than many casual types,so therefore have a strong basis for my opinions.The reason I'm not brand loyal for anything is because I've seen far too many issues on everything-including Honda-despite what some would have you believe.

If Im wrong then prove me wrong    I believe the debate we have going here is like beating a dead horse.