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Offline SachsGS

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Is This the Future?
« on: July 21, 2013, 05:22:57 PM »
                                       

What I can't get over is that these electric motorcycles sound identical to my son's electric ATV that he had from ages 2 to 5.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »

Offline Boogsy

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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2013, 09:06:55 PM »
no. its for the fat people and homeboys in walmart.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »

Offline factoryX

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« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2013, 01:45:55 AM »
F-ing BS. Very unfair when its a dead engine start, not only that, but everyone literally were riding insanely slow. You look on the video he totes "Unstallable Electric motor," I guess he's never heard of rekluse clutches. I would personally love to see this bike at erzberg....
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »


I ride an 03 yz250, wait 04, wait 05, what ever, they're all the same #$@% YOU!

Offline citabjockey

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Is This the Future?
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2013, 05:38:51 AM »
I would like to confirm that this class was correct for the Zero rider. It looked like he was sandbagging relative to a bunch of green 'C' riders. Anyone know if this is the case?

If not then the capability of this scooter in THIS APPLICATION (muddy 40 minute event) cannot be denied. Even if you say its unfair he doesn't even have to push a button at the start. Heck, when I try to boot over my 380 while everyone else uses there magic button I don't whine about it.

Now, as to reality. Yes the bike kicked butt (maybe because it was a pro versus 'c' riders -- I remain skeptical) but its very expensive and will only let you go 40 minutes. Not all day on 70 mile loop trail rides.  How many cycles before the bike-priced battery is trash? How robust are the components in the drive -- electric and otherwise?

And how much fun is it really to ride? I gotta say I love my two stroke but I also love to ride -- perhaps even to the point where I could have fun on an e-bike -- even if not as much as on my 380.

But we should expect videos and results (like the pikes peek race e-bike win)  to keep popping up as the technology and engineering advance. Its just the way it is.



« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
Yamaha CT3, RT3, MX125, SC500, Toy Prius, Diesel F250 (it all balances out)

Offline VintageBlueSmoke

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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2013, 09:31:41 AM »
Rather ride an e-bike than a 4-stroke...just sayin'.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
08 Speed Bird Quad 110, 08 KTM 144, 04 Suzuki LT-Z400, 03 Gas Gas EC, 300,97 Honda CR144, 96 Husky Boy 50, 88 Husky 400WR, 86 Honda CR125R, 80 Can-Am MX6 400, 75 Husky 360CR, 75 Husky 175CC, 73 Penton Jackpiner 175, 72 Husky 250CR, 72 Husky 125, 72 Rickman-Zundapp 125, (2) 71 Bultaco Pursang Mk

Offline Boogsy

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« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2013, 10:14:53 AM »
hello welcome to wallmart. scooters to your right my man.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »

Offline VintageBlueSmoke

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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2013, 10:49:05 AM »
hello welcome to wallmart. scooters to your right my man.

Meet you there? We'll set up a course and see if we can pull off 2 45 minute motos? Extra points for kills of course...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
08 Speed Bird Quad 110, 08 KTM 144, 04 Suzuki LT-Z400, 03 Gas Gas EC, 300,97 Honda CR144, 96 Husky Boy 50, 88 Husky 400WR, 86 Honda CR125R, 80 Can-Am MX6 400, 75 Husky 360CR, 75 Husky 175CC, 73 Penton Jackpiner 175, 72 Husky 250CR, 72 Husky 125, 72 Rickman-Zundapp 125, (2) 71 Bultaco Pursang Mk

Offline rlaj1004

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Is This the Future?
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2013, 02:05:18 PM »
hello welcome to wallmart. scooters to your right my man.

Meet you there? We'll set up a course and see if we can pull off 2 45 minute motos? Extra points for kills of course...

Oh I'm in, and there is enough giantly fat people at my walmart, we could use them as berms.
But that would be the only place I ever put my ass on an E bike, just doesn't seem like riding.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »

Offline SachsGS

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« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2013, 04:13:36 PM »
I remember one insanely slick cross country race where I had to push my Maico up almost every slick hill that I couldn't find a way around. When I finished the race there wasn't a drop of coolant left in the bike. I've also ridden 4T$ in muddy conditions where the 4T wouldn't hook up but a 2T would. Which leads me to my next question - how well was that Zero finding traction?

I agree that the Zero rider was probably just cherry picking. While all the "C's" were waiting for bottle necks he just rode around them.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »

Offline VintageBlueSmoke

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« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2013, 05:33:33 PM »
Having ridden my sons Oset 12.5, I can say the application of power is...strange. There is a lot of wheelspin at first, basically because it is immediately at whatever speed the potentiometer (throttle) is turned to but then it is steady at that and locks up. You can squeeze the power on but it takes (a lot of) practice to get it right.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
08 Speed Bird Quad 110, 08 KTM 144, 04 Suzuki LT-Z400, 03 Gas Gas EC, 300,97 Honda CR144, 96 Husky Boy 50, 88 Husky 400WR, 86 Honda CR125R, 80 Can-Am MX6 400, 75 Husky 360CR, 75 Husky 175CC, 73 Penton Jackpiner 175, 72 Husky 250CR, 72 Husky 125, 72 Rickman-Zundapp 125, (2) 71 Bultaco Pursang Mk

Offline citabjockey

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Is This the Future?
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2013, 05:50:31 PM »
Well, it sure wasn't the "magic pulses"


Which leads me to my next question - how well was that Zero finding traction?

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
Yamaha CT3, RT3, MX125, SC500, Toy Prius, Diesel F250 (it all balances out)

Offline SachsGS

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« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2013, 03:52:43 PM »
Info. from the Zero site - 54 hp/70 ft lbs torque, 112 mile range (under "normal" conditions) and 60 second battery change.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »

Offline citabjockey

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« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2013, 05:07:45 PM »
That range doesn't look so bad. But it comes with a 12,000 price tag and a 265lb curb weight.

They also say a charge costs less than a buck. So lets say you believe them and get 100 miles per charge. Lets do a little math:

My 380 goes through a couple of gallons in 60 miles. Roughly 30MPG so will chew about 3 gallons in that 100 miles, USA prices, 12 bucks.
Zero says the battery will last 3000 hours. I *might* be able to make a 20 MPH average on a typical trail ride so 3000 hours gets 60,000 miles.
so 600 tanks of gas, which is about $7200 bucks in gas compared to about $600 in electric charges. Of course in that 3000 hours there will
be at least a few top end changes on the 380 at about $500 apiece, maybe a couple of bottom end rebuilds too at $800 each which bumps the cost of the 380 for those 3000 hours up to $7200 + ($500 * 10) + ($800 * 3) or about $14k. At this point we could neglect my purchase price of the 380 (which was about 2k). The zero seems to come out the winner in terms of long term cost but you have to finance a big up front capital spend (or borrow) to get into one. Of course this analysis neglects all the running gear maint which should be similar between the two bikes.

Now if you compare that $12k zero against a current 450F at $9k then the costs over time look even worse for gas engines.

All of the above hinges on believing you can get 3000 hours out of a battery pack, you only want to ride 100 miles without waiting for a recharge, you are ok with a 265 lb curb weight, and that the other drive electronics/motors/gears on the zero doesn't break. If you have to swap inverters and motors on a regular basis then the equation could change quite a bit. Oh and as that battery approaches the 3000 hour lifespan I would expect you cannot get anywhere near 100 miles out of it anymore. Oh and the zero legs are only good for 9 or so inches of travel. I am kinda used to 13 on the back of my 380! This could be how Zero got the weight below 300 lbs?




Info. from the Zero site - 54 hp/70 ft lbs torque, 112 mile range (under "normal" conditions) and 60 second battery change.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
Yamaha CT3, RT3, MX125, SC500, Toy Prius, Diesel F250 (it all balances out)

Offline factoryX

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« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2013, 08:41:19 PM »
60 second battery charge is incredibly damaging to a battery, and if its a lithium polymer battery even more so. 60,000 miles on a dirt bike? :o :o
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »


I ride an 03 yz250, wait 04, wait 05, what ever, they're all the same #$@% YOU!

Offline citabjockey

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« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2013, 08:58:15 PM »
There 3000 hour battery leads to 60,000 miles. Yes, on a dirt bike? not bloody likely.

And the 60 seconds is a battery swap (change) not charge. For that little feature you have to buy a 2nd battery pack.

Oh and then if you go this route you have to picture on a bike weekend you will not have a electric source. So you use your generator. Given that the charger-battery-motor energy path is not much better than 50% efficient the miles per generator gallon on this bike would be pretty bad. probably worse than my 380 when stuffing charge into the battery with a generator. Plus you would have to listen to the darn thing even if you weren't watching your 50" TV at the campsite.


60 second battery charge is incredibly damaging to a battery, and if its a lithium polymer battery even more so. 60,000 miles on a dirt bike? :o :o
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 04:00:00 PM by ' »
Yamaha CT3, RT3, MX125, SC500, Toy Prius, Diesel F250 (it all balances out)