Messages

76

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: 4 $troke lovers= delusional people

« on: August 03, 2011, 08:58:00 AM »

Another issue is people need to get over the whole "I hate EFI" Or "Carbs work just fine" point of view. If you want to keep using your decade old bike fine, but if there is room for improvement why not do it. They work great in Sleds, they work Great in boat motors, and they also work great 2 stroke diesel applications.  

That's certainly true, there is always room for improvement but that comes at a cost doesn't it.  Is a new EFI or DI 2-stroke going to be affordable or are we just gonna be looking at another 8-10k motorcycle?  I think everyone agrees the advantage of a current 2-stroke is they cost less to produce and maintain.  Taking away half that advantage doesn't make it as appealing when the dealer is willing to give you that 2 year old floor model 4-stroke for 2k off sticker, but he wants full price for the 8k 2-stroke. 

77

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: 4 $troke lovers= delusional people

« on: August 01, 2011, 12:05:43 PM »

One thing you guys who say the 2 stroke 250's don't dominate, leave out... The fact that fast riders do not ride a 2 stroke. Unless they are KTM riders and even then it's iffy. Why?  Because they get bikes either really discounted or free, depending on the dealer.  For instance, and fact.  Brandon Haas went to a Yamaha 450F, after asking for a YZ250.  The dealer gave him a better deal on the 450F than a 250 2 stroke with 6 year old development.  How's that for a kick in the teeth.  He went with a 4 stroke, only because he was pressured into it. The dealer wouldn't budge on the 250 2 stroke price, even as a sponsored rider.   But the 450F, got thousands off.  250F's are even cheaper with those discounts. So not many fast riders will shell out an extra couple thousands, just because they want to.  Fact is, Bud Moore is doing very well against 450F's with his 2002 stock CR250R.  I sent him an intake, but other than that and a pipe, stock.  He has not had it ported yet. 

You took a really long way around saying it, but the difference is now and has always been the rider.  You put the winning 250F guys on 2-strokes and they'll win.  All this talk about what gets better traction where doesn't mean anything when it comes down to skills and talent.  The advantage of a 2-stroke in the hands of any rider is simplicity and expense. 

I dunno what happened to Bud's CR but the last several times I've seen him over the past couple months he is back on his 4-stroke. 

78

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: 4 $troke lovers= delusional people

« on: July 29, 2011, 04:52:39 AM »

Well the freestyle comparison isn't all that close.  I see none of those guys attack corners before their ramps like a racer would, I have no doubt a 250F could make anything on a freestyle course. 

But you have to cut his family some slack probably.  Lemoine is young enough that if he raced 2-stroke big bikes at all it wasn't much, and who knows he if ever threw a leg over a 250 2-stroke.  Much like a relgious or political disscussion, all you can really do is smile and nod.  Nothing you say is going to change their minds. 

79

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: We lost another one.....

« on: July 28, 2011, 04:14:07 AM »

There was a young lady who died last year in a first turn crash at Loretta Lynn's too.  I dunno what is happening but I sure don't remember so many people dying in this sport at any point during the 30 years I've been around it.  Praying for the family.

80

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: My 450F beater

« on: July 26, 2011, 05:12:52 AM »

Where did you buy the titanium fork springs from?  I've seen a lot of people offering the rear shock, but not forks.  Very nice build, if I had the money I'd love to put a Gorr-built 300 into a modern 250F frame. 

81

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: Mike Horban Qualified for Washougal on a yz250

« on: July 24, 2011, 03:29:32 AM »

The bike blew up a couple laps into the moto.  He actually had no intention of racing that bike, he brought a brand new 2012 KX450F to tech and the AMA told him to take it home, wasn't legal.  Kawi hadn't submitted the bike for the homoligation rule yet so he was forced to unload the YZ.  Thankfully it wasn't a newer YZ because those aren't submitted or legal either even though it's the same freaking bike. 

82

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: Talent trumps all else?

« on: June 28, 2011, 09:24:25 AM »

You don't have to look back very far in AMA history for your answer.  When Windham made his return to the line on a CRF450 while everyone else was on 250 2-strokes, he gave RC fits for most of the season.  Windham is a strong outdoor rider, but when you leveled the playing field RC got his second perfect season.  Second example is look at how Stewart struggled while Kawi kept him on a 250 an extra year after everyone else went to the 450. Yes he ran up front but when speed among people is pretty equal, the extra power of the 450 makes a difference.  Especially now that the bikes are down to the weight limit, which was certainly not the case 5 or 6 years ago.

As for Cedric Soubeyras, I dunno..  I wouldn't hold my breath on him lighting the world on fire especially outdoors.  He raced the French GP a few weeks ago and managed a single point between 2 motos.  SX would have been anyone's guess, but I still say he'd have trouble making the main at best. 

83

Technical / Re: 2005 CR250R

« on: June 18, 2011, 11:04:19 AM »

The 300 kit from Gorr is your best investment if you're looking for something to compete in straight-line speed with a 450.  For comfort and ridability you'll definitely need to re-spring the bike for your weight. 

84

Non-Moto / Re: Will this Direct injection 2 stroke have the smooth lazy power of a 4 stroke?

« on: June 18, 2011, 10:13:15 AM »

My question would be why would you even want it?  Same with fuel injection.  The appeal of 2-strokes is 3 fold for me: 1) cost 2) weight 3) ease to repair.  By adding electronics, fuel pumps, or anything else besides a stone-age carb you're taking away all 3 of those advantages.  To me if 2-strokes want to really make a comeback they need to approach things completely different.  Build a bare bones race bike the public can buy at half the price of anything currently out. 

85

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: Jeff Gibson

« on: June 12, 2011, 06:55:03 PM »

A 250f has twice the CC of a 125. A 450 has under twice the CC of a 250. Just because there is less of a difference 250 to 125, it is not easier.

Agreed. The touque those little 250f time bombs are putting out would be harder for a small bore 2 stroke to match in the pro class were everyone is almost perfect. The big bikes are just fast 2 and 4.

Ahhh thanks guys, i didnt take that into consideration i was thinking just in terms of horsepower

With the AMA pro gas rules a 125 would be totally gutless compared to heavily modified 250Fs.  Back in the day with 2-strokes people ran high octane leaded fuel, which is now outlawed.  A 125 suffers a much bigger disadvantage from that than a 250.  That's not to say it can't be done.  One fast lap is all it takes to make the gate, which in the unseeded B practice would be easiest to get.  But off the start it would be terrible, and passing 250Fs on momentum alone is a brutal chore. 

86

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: Pro Circuit RM250 Test!

« on: June 03, 2011, 04:50:12 AM »

The bike has to have been submitted to the AMA by the manufacturer.  There in lies the problem, because most OEMs don't bother to submit their 2-stroke lines anymore. 

Here's a website that tells what is and isn't legal in AMA Pro Racing, as you can see Suzuki hasn't submitted a 2-stroke to be included since 2006. 

http://motocrossactionmag.com/Main/News/APPROVED-MOTORCYCLES-FOR-2011-SUPERCROSS-MOTOCROSS-7733.aspx

87

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: 2 Stroke at Hangtown

« on: May 11, 2011, 07:20:33 AM »

It isn't merely about what should be legal. The bike must have been submitted by the factory and proved to be homologated.  Very few, including KTM, care to bother with this.  That's why you never see the occasional Euro bike like a TM or Gas Gas out there. 

88

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: 2 Stroke at Hangtown

« on: May 10, 2011, 07:22:29 AM »

The only 125 that currently qualifies for the AMA rules is a Yamaha made in the last 2 years.  And while Lil Goose is fast, I'm not sure he could make the gate. 

89

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: Petition Update

« on: April 30, 2011, 03:29:06 AM »

only when 2 strokes are consistantly seen up the front will anything happen

But is that the problem. I mean all the shootouts are done with 250F's but you can run a 250 smoker in the lights class both here and Aussie yet the young guys who have never thrown a leg over a 250 smoker are still led to believe the F is the way to go.
Massive marketing over the years have pushed the smoker to "old" status.
There needs to be full shootouts with the bikes that are allowable in the lites class.
But the magizines rely on advertising dollars from the manufactors. Catch 22. Don't know if the magizines have the ball's.
As you know DK won the lites class here on a YZ but the latest Yamaha add has specials on 250F's & 450F's. WTF ?
Forget about any of the manufactors putting 2 strokes on the track, Not gunna happen.
The way I see it is a wealthy private team that get's no backing from a manufactor need's to put a team of 2 strokes together and see what happens. Know any one ?
Some how there needs to be a way of showing to privateers the benefits of running a 2 stroke against the 50k factory bikes.
The only guys to have run 2 strokes the last year both here & Aussie were old guys.
We need young guys on them.

Let me ask you this.. Do you have the balls to do something the guys signing your paycheck don't want you to do?  Knowing full well if you piss them off bad enough they'll quit paying you?  That's the position these mags are in.  It's easy to write a little blurb in a story like the test of the YZ, but it's another to test all the 250s together and say the YZ is still head and shoulders above all the 250F's.  Not even Yamaha wants that because the YZ is such a limited production run, the 250F is their main bike still. 

The OEMs rule a lot more than just the AMA series, it's not so easy to go against that and hope to keep making a living in this small sport.  No one is getting rich here.  In my humble opinion the answer is to keep it grassroots and just ride.  Show and tell people which bike is better and more cost effective.  When the OEMs 4-stroke sales drop sharply enough they'll either go back to 2-strokes or pull out of this market entirely.  Then you have to hope the Euro manufactures, or God forbid the Chinese, pick up the slack and give you some option to buy. 

90

General Two Stroke Talk / Re: MXA:2011 YZ250: THE BIKE WE'D ALL BE RIDING IF THE AMA DIDN'T FAVOR FOUR-STROKES

« on: April 12, 2011, 09:55:46 PM »

Meh, in my honest opinion buying a 2011 YZ250 is about like buying a new 4-stroke. Yamaha has mailed this bike in since '06.  If I'm going to pay top dollar for a new bike give me a TM or KTM.  Otherwise I'll buy an '06 YZ and be riding the same thing for not even 1/2 the cost...