2 Strokes vs 4 strokes hill climbing

[GP500cc]

 

Modern 4-strokes can't go near idle without stalling.? A 300 2-banger can go right down to near idle and keep going, and it's delivery is super smooth off the bottom. That's why 2-strokes dominate extreme enduros in my opinion. Over the years I've noticed more 300 2-bangers in extreme enduro results than any other bike. The 2011 Erzberg had just 9 finishers they were all 2-strokes, 2 250's and 7 300's.

[SachsGS]

2Ts are lighter, easier to turn, generate more torque cc vs. cc, are more responsive and a lot easier to restart.

[riffraff]

No contest 

[VintageBlueSmoke]

Rewatch "On Any Sunday" and pay particular attention to the part about hill climbing. In it, they show the nitro burning BSA, extended swingarm monsters rocketing up the hill. Then they show Malcolm Smith on a stock 400 Husky. He was 4th OVERALL!

Not bad for a little 2-stroke!

[Bioflex]

There's a lot more to it than this.
A lot depends on the terrain, in my experience (I have multiple modern 2 and 4 strokes) small bore 2 strokes really struggle on slower, rocky hills where traction is difficult and you can't carry good speed.

Up smoother tight hills, even slippery ones, small bores are awesome!

Big bore 2 strokes are great up any hill, unless you have to be very sensitive with the throttle.

Generally speaking though if the hills tough, I think a 4 strokes a bit easier to get up on, however the difference is less than it used to be, as modern 4 strokes don't like to lug much.

[eprovenzano]

Rewatch "On Any Sunday" and pay particular attention to the part about hill climbing. In it, they show the nitro burning BSA, extended swingarm monsters rocketing up the hill. Then they show Malcolm Smith on a stock 400 Husky. He was 4th OVERALL!

Not bad for a little 2-stroke!

Malcolm Smith was and still is in a different league altogether.  He was just so smooth, no wasted movement, no wasted effort.  His ability to pick the correct lines were amazing.  At the end of a long race, he looked as though he could run the race again and still not be as tired as the other racers.

BTW "On Any Sunday" what a classis movie

As 2 vs 4's, I've only ridden smokers, but I could understand the additional torque of a stroker being helpfull at times, but give me the light weight, smoker and I will make it work for me while putting a bigger smile on my face.  To me that's what its all about, the grin factor.

[gc8steve]

i recently went from a crf250x to a tm300 and have gotta say that the 2t is a lot easier to get up any hill or through any big mud bog than my 4 stroke ever was , i always belived the 4 stroke was able to put the power down better in all situations but now i know i'd rather have my tm  or any 300 for that matter out in the bush , last week i went for a ride on some old trails that always tested my ability to the max on the honda ,hit up the same trail that included some real nasty rock climbs and wet slippery clay hills and the 300 made it feel easy

[SachsGS]

If the climb is really gnarly with rock steps, logs etc. the 4T$ are pretty much hopeless.

[factoryX]

lmfao. Two words answer the hill climb two stroke vs four stroke argument: Erzberg Rodeo. How many 4 strokes came in the top ten? 

[VintageBlueSmoke]

i recently went from a crf250x to a tm300 and have gotta say that the 2t is a lot easier to get up any hill or through any big mud bog than my 4 stroke ever was , i always belived the 4 stroke was able to put the power down better in all situations but now i know i'd rather have my tm  or any 300 for that matter out in the bush , last week i went for a ride on some old trails that always tested my ability to the max on the honda ,hit up the same trail that included some real nasty rock climbs and wet slippery clay hills and the 300 made it feel easy

Unfortunately, that is not a good example. You are comparing apples to oranges. A CRF250X is about equivalent to a 125 2-stroke (enduro type, i.e KTM EXC) where as the 4-stroke equivalent of the TM300 is the 450F.

The CRF250X has to be zung up hills. It really was gutless when you think about it. You'd have no such problem with the 450. That said, we have a hill on our MX track that the 250 out performs the 2-strokes. It is long and steep with loose dirt square edge step woops all the way to the top. And just to make it more difficult, there is a kink 1/2 way up. It is not hard in the sense that some people can't make it. It is hard with the "trying to go fast" in mind.

[gc8steve]

i recently went from a crf250x to a tm300 and have gotta say that the 2t is a lot easier to get up any hill or through any big mud bog than my 4 stroke ever was , i always belived the 4 stroke was able to put the power down better in all situations but now i know i'd rather have my tm  or any 300 for that matter out in the bush , last week i went for a ride on some old trails that always tested my ability to the max on the honda ,hit up the same trail that included some real nasty rock climbs and wet slippery clay hills and the 300 made it feel easy

Unfortunately, that is not a good example. You are comparing apples to oranges. A CRF250X is about equivalent to a 125 2-stroke (enduro type, i.e KTM EXC) where as the 4-stroke equivalent of the TM300 is the 450F.

ok fair enough , the tm300 was able to climb up hills that i could never get close to getting up on my crf450x

The CRF250X has to be zung up hills. It really was gutless when you think about it. You'd have no such problem with the 450. That said, we have a hill on our MX track that the 250 out performs the 2-strokes. It is long and steep with loose dirt square edge step woops all the way to the top. And just to make it more difficult, there is a kink 1/2 way up. It is not hard in the sense that some people can't make it. It is hard with the "trying to go fast" in mind.

[Stusmoke]

I like it how all these modern 'enduro' foopers struggle sometimes. I've never seen a piece of terrain that a late 90's XR250R couldn't conquer. And what is this madness about stalling? Those old monsters used to get up slopes at 2 grand no worries whatsoever.

[Lolerbabop]

You're all saying different things..

[SachsGS]

I guess hills mean different things to different people. I've ridden 4T$ up massive desert non technical hills and for that they work well. If you have a Romaniacs style nightmare hill confronting you the only way up may just be a 300cc 2T.

[_X_]

I saw the guy pass an rm 250 on the way up. it is all about rider skill not about bike. if youre fast youre fast.if your slow youre slow. etc. we just choose to ride two strokes.