The Euro's advance while Yamaha's BNG's only falls farther behind.

[ford832]

So why doesn't Yamaha update the YZ instead of sticking with their old technology?
This is the kind of thing I hear on here all the time.Fwiw,I wish they'd update their plastic too,but then,I never liked it when it came out in 02.In my old age I do tend to be a form follows function type of guy-which is why I have one.
Anyway,having listened to the new euro tech and old Jap tech argument every month or so here-and never managing to see what was actually new tech from the Euro's other than plastic or colours,I found the new Dirt rider 125 shootout rather interesting.They said good and bad of everything,including the YZ,but given the "old tech" YZ is just stumbling along,marking time according to most,I'll hit a couple high points for interests sake.
According to Dirt Rider,the YZ has......

The most snap and ferocity off the bottom and picked up the best when coming off throttle.
Super crisp jetting.
The "get on it and go" bike of the comparison.
Best suspension
Tight feeling with proven reliability record.
Etc,etc
....and the most interesting to me- 6 pounds lighter than the next lightest bike. 

The moral of the story is,the next time someone has the urge to blatt about the old tech YZ's,maybe you should try one first.
BTW,I'm not a Yamaha fanboy,I just try to see things as they are.If I was looking for a new 125,I know the Yamaha is the most logical choice but I'd have a hard time passing up the Husky-just because I like it.

Oh yeah,the YZ won the shootout.   Old technology rules mofo's! 

[nom de guerre]

Frustrating aesthetically...... BUT, at least it is an option for the 2t crowd. The bike is still a proven machine... Not falling behind if it still wins.

[ford832]

More than just an option-for a racer or someone who wants the best 125 motorcycle for their buck-it's the best choice-unless the shape of the plastic counts towards finishing position or points.

[nom de guerre]

Well said Ford, I agree...  Glad they are available still. I almost bought one instead of my KTM this year, the old look is what swayed me more than anything else. I knew I was walking away from a great machine.

[metal_miracle]

I like the Yamaha front forks..
but paying twice the amount of money as a uses yz, and just getting new sticker.. Just isnt worth my money..

this is yamaha`s problem right now... people look for used yz instead of new. when design gets so stale

[SachsGS]

C'mon now Ford,you don't actually believe Dirt Rider,do you?In today's tight economy the thought of losing those advertizing Yamabucks was something the editors at DR just couldn't risk.Where's Super Hunky when you need him?

[Super Trucker]

If I bought a new 125, it would be a YZ. IF the plastic doesn,t hook on your boots or knees, who cares if it,s dated, it,s functional. The cr125 if made yet, would easily win the shootout, with just a different pipe. The cr and yz  had  very equil powerbands, the cr,s stock jetting was way rich, made 34.89 hp. When your stock reeds are junk, everybody uses a different reed block and most change pipes, then the cr pulls the yz with the same mods.

[Cheb44]

Bottom line who do you want to buy a bike from?

A company that is putting money into research and development into new two strokes

or

A company who raced for years and spent tons of money on r&d only to abandon a cause we believe in and lead to where we are today.

Sure the yz is a great bike but Yamaha has the power to bring it back strong but doesn't.  What does that tell me?  That they don't give a s**t about what we want.  If you want a yz buy a used one, don't buy new.  I find their bone they throw us insulting personally.

[scotty dog]

Bottom line who do you want to buy a bike from?

A company that is putting money into research and development into new two strokes

or

A company who raced for years and spent tons of money on r&d only to abandon a cause we believe in and lead to where we are today.

Sure the yz is a great bike but Yamaha has the power to bring it back strong but doesn't.  What does that tell me?  That they don't give a s**t about what we want.  If you want a yz buy a used one, don't buy new.  I find their bone they throw us insulting personally.

Good point Cheb44, i believe Yamaha started this whole 4 stroke bullshit too, they would have spent a gazillion getting that backwards piece of crap 450 off the ground!! They should of left it and spent the money on the 2 stroke line up

[ford832]

heres the thing about the yz. its a great bike and it has a good motor and susp package. but the problem is you can buy a used 06 for 2000, put new tires, top end, bars graphics, etc and still be under the cost of buying a brand new yz not counting tax, fees and reg.

by choosing a euro brand that perhaps needs minor tuning with sprokets and susp which would be bought for the yz anyways. you are telling manufacturers they need to continue to put r&d into the bike. if anything make some updates to more than just stickers.

dirt rider wasnt saying anythin special about the yz just that out of the box is was the most well rounded. it isnt the fastest that goes to the ktm.

honestly there test more seems like a first impression test. nothing was noted about  correcting gearing, jetting, or changing springs and oil levels to see how they faired with minor tuning

Once again,I just don't know what to say.Where exactly is this R&D you talk about-examples please.Where are the Euros superior to the Yamaha?You say the Euros need tweaking  but the YZ is ready right out the box-is that because of the euro R&D or is the R&D responsible for the 6 or more extra pounds or the lesser power or worse suspension?
According to Dirt rider,the Yamaha had the most power off the bottom,the KTM had the most top,it's a push.
If you can buy an 06 for two grand and still have the best 125 on the track-and save about 5 grand,that's a bad thing somehow?
So,If I go out to buy a TV,Microwave,Couch,Truck or whatever and the salesman says-ok,you will need to get it worked on first as it doesn't work as well as the other guys-but ck out the cool new exterior.Yeah,I'd be all over that " title="Roll Eyes" class="smiley">
This mysterious,so far unexplained "R&D" aside,Yamaha still builds a complete 2t line(and is considered the best by most) and imports them to North America-unlike Suzuki,Honda and Kawasaki-no wonder some of you would like to boycott them.
If Yamaha's 2t line for '12 came with the new 4t plastic and a suspension or axle size tweak just to say they did something,half of you on here would go nuts about the awesome new Yamaha-that's actually rather sad.

[ford832]

Bottom line who do you want to buy a bike from?

A company that is putting money into research and development into new two strokes

or

A company who raced for years and spent tons of money on r&d only to abandon a cause we believe in and lead to where we are today.

Sure the yz is a great bike but Yamaha has the power to bring it back strong but doesn't.  What does that tell me?  That they don't give a s**t about what we want.  If you want a yz buy a used one, don't buy new.  I find their bone they throw us insulting personally.

There's that R&D thing again.Details please.You can't just write something and assume because you did it's somehow true.
How did they abandon the cause?They import a complete line that is largely regarded to be  the best in the industry.
So,let me see,they still import them,they're the best or at least pretty close to everything else out there,they're lighter,for the most part,faster,as cheap or cheaper,stand up as good or usually better and er...um...they've abandoned......um........Yeah,I'd be pissed of at getting thrown that kind of bone as well.
Honestly,some of you here really need to give your head a shake and disregard the rattle inside.New plastic may trip the trip the trigger of many of you younger types,but it hardly defines the machine,the technology behind it-nor the company that builds and imports it.
BTW,I still like the Husky but I fully realize the limitations of it and the work I'd have to put into it to get it right.
90% of the 125 market hasn't a clue what to do with the engine,suspension,gearing or anything else on their new bike and would be wayyyyyyy better off buying the YZ than one of the Euro's.I find it distressing that many on here would steer them the other way-and in so doing likely put them on a 4t after they got discouraged with what they'd bought.

[Cheb44]

its not all about mx bikes, there is lots going into both enduro and mx bikes from brands like ktm and Husq.

pfft for all I know Yamaha just had a bunch of left over 125s they are still getting rid of.  Not likely I know that was tongue in cheek.

In all honesty until someone goes FI there aren't alot of big improvements to be made on any of the bikes.

[SachsGS]

Ford I think you are flogging a dead horse - she ain't getting up.All of the Euros are sending us riders quality made,continually improving machinery. Yamaha sends us the same old,same old while spending all of the R and D bucks on 4T$ that the market has clearly demonstrated they don't want.Like your fixation with Yamaha,there seems to be a disconnect between what the Japanese manufacturers think we want and what enthusiasts actually buy,just look at KTM's sales figures.

As far as the BMW GSs are concerned,everybody complains about the price and then buys them anyway - just ask two friends of mine.The BMW 1000 is an overwhelming success where it counts,in the marketplace.

When you are reincarnated,I am certain you will speak fluent German and work on the 3 series assembly line.



 

[Jeram]

what on earth are you on about ford, misterious/non-existent development from the euros

the KTM crank case design has changed 3-4 times since 2000
the KTMs were given a 6 speed gearbox in 2010
The KTMs were had their port timing revised and their transfer ports fixed in 2006 as they previously opened backwards
reed intakes have been upgraded from Vforce 3 to Vforce 4,
And Im sure many many other things have been altered in this period too, and thats just the engine!

other manufacturers are the same.
TM i beleive has gone from a mechanical PV to an electronic PV
their suspension has changed from ohlins to marzocchi (forced, not a choice)
port timing again revised
chassis went from steel to aluminium a few years ago
etc etc, thats just a few notable items off the top of my head

the exact same is apparent with husky gas gas and the others, just read the last 5 years of reviews...

[motoman356]

yes the yz may be the most well rounded but the last time a company stopped developing a bike the kx 500 died. they stopped updating in 94 and ultimately dropped around 04.

if a model car or bike is not recieving any updates other than cosmetics how can i feel assured they are investing in the bike? all it tells me is they know people want the bike still and they can sell us the same stuff cuz were so desparate.

my point about the other bikes is 1) the bikes are tuned for europe not american taste. so if you make a small gearing change or send your susp off to have it tuned to your taste. which would be done anyways with most bikes yz125 or any other model produced. 2) the euro bikes are recieving updayes every year unlike the yamaha.