the cost to micro blue coat a motor

[kim wedding]

Dogger and cncrpla thank's for the knowledge.I was afraid no one would read my post or answer it cause of the crazy stuff. so thank's again.

[Jeram]

Sorry to break it to you dogger but cryo treatment, performed post-manufacturing is complete snake oil, aka claims to do amazing things but does nothing.
When done properly you can cool a part slowly after casting or forging to create a single crystal part (turbine blades etc) object which has all the properties they claim in the brochure. But if you allow the part to cool normally and then cryo treat it, it does zip/nada/nil/nothing etc

Kim, you keep using the term  solution, how is this an emissions solution? You keep avoiding the million dollar question by arguing with other members. While there is still oil entering the cases with the fuel there will still be high particle emissions. But there is already a solution to that, buy an Ossa 300i (bout the same price as a new ktm)

[kim wedding]

I NEVER USED THE WORD SOLUTION,but it's as good as any word for it. Isnt a SOLUTION what we're all hopeing for? A ossa 300 seems to be your SOLUTION to the problem. Is it clean burning? I hope some thing work's and that it's not all snake oil. You talk as if you know alot so do you know of anything that works or just how to piss on everything. I posted to tell what i learned and to learn from other's knowledge. I did'nt know or could'nt of imagined how off the wall some of this crap is. If i posted some thing you don't agree with that fine . If i said some thing and you did'nt get it, ask me, i'm more than glad to explain myself . one guy was mad becaue he thought i was pushing my choice of bike on him, we talked it out. PROBLEM SOLVED.To all the people who've answered my post with some manners and no attitude.  THANKS THANKS THANKS.

[GlennC]

I CAT ?

[Jeram]

I NEVER USED THE WORD SOLUTION,but it's as good as any word for it. Isnt a SOLUTION what we're all hopeing for? A ossa 300 seems to be your SOLUTION to the problem. Is it clean burning? I hope some thing work's and that it's not all snake oil. You talk as if you know alot so do you know of anything that works or just how to piss on everything. I posted to tell what i learned and to learn from other's knowledge. I did'nt know or could'nt of imagined how off the wall some of this crap is. If i posted some thing you don't agree with that fine . If i said some thing and you did'nt get it, ask me, i'm more than glad to explain myself . one guy was mad becaue he thought i was pushing my choice of bike on him, we talked it out. PROBLEM SOLVED.To all the people who've answered my post with some manners and no attitude.  THANKS THANKS THANKS.

The Ossa is claimed to be cleaner that the four strokes and I dont find it hard to believe because the latest injected two stroke snowmobiles and pwc's are cleaner than four strokes.

If the emmissions solution was cheap and easy an oem manufacturer would be doing it already. But sadly it's got nothing to do with special coatings and direct injecting a two stroke is hard to get right (v-due disaster)

But at the end of the day whether you ride a dirty two stroke or a clean on for a few hours on the weekend isn't going to make any difference. Towing your bike to where you ride with a fuel efficient car vs a big old F100 would probably have the same effect.

[msmola2002]

[Jeram]

haha

[dogger315]

But if you allow the part to cool normally and then cryo treat it, it does zip/nada/nil/nothing etc

 
I won't bore you with too much science, but I like to verify claims before I make them.  Before i bought into the
Cryo-REM process, I took some samples  to work and tested them.  First up was a stock Honda transmission gear. 
I performed a hardness test using a Brinell tester and came up with a value of 364 HB which roughly corresponds
to hardened 4340 low alloy steel.  So now I knew what the gears were made of and had a baseline for comparison. 
Next part was the same kind of gear that had been treated to DCT subsequent to manufacturer.  This gear tested
384 HB, a 5.5% increase in hardness over the stock gear.  That's a significant amount.  I also examined the gears
using the Xray diffraction 6 line method and discovered a marked reduction in austenite in the DCT gear.  This
suggest the metal was changed at the molecular level - so much for "zip/nada/etc".  Oh and by the way, as should
be the case with any experiment, I tested a half dozen different gears - treated and untreated, to minimize
production variations effects on my results.  So the numbers I posted are averages.

I'm guessing from your comments you are a machinist and your experience with this process (if any), is confined
to SCT (shallow cryogenic treatment).  The difference between that and DCT (deep cryogenic treatment), are
significant.  With SCT, a part is cooled to 193K, removed and simply allowed to warm to room temperature.  With
DCT, the part is cooled all the way down to 77K, kept at that temperature for a lengthy time and then warmed up
slowly using a controlled schedule.     

dogger

[2T Institute]

Hardness of a gear is pretty much irrelevant.Gears are around 63-65HRc (dunno the Brinnel scale) on the skin. Hardneing on a gear is a skin under the case hardening the EN36a/b or equivalent is soft as a marshmellow. If they were not the gearbox would not last long at all.
Cryo treated any parts including whole engines at once and yet to find any increase of HP on the dyno or reduction in lap times. Some pistons showed a mild increase in service life is all I have ever found.

[_X_]

I see I can't say say shit on here without offending someone. Ha!

[dogger315]

Hardness of a gear is pretty much irrelevant

Nonsense.  The hardness/tensile strength of a steel is the only quantitative
measure of that material's resistance to plastic deformation.  In what universe
is that irrelevant?

My original assertion was/is that Cryo-REM treatment strengthens the metal (it does)
and reduces friction (it does that too).  I made no claims about increased HP (though
I suspect that's the case).  What I do claim, is that Cryo-REM treatment lowers friction
and will increase the service life of my gearbox.

dogger