Vintage Racing

[JETZcorp]

I was a little hesitant to make this thread, given that we already have a lot of two-post-threads, and something on this topic might further make the 4T guys think we're all a bunch of grey-bearded men born in 1955, but I thought it would be interesting nonetheless.

Who among us competes in vintage MX racing?  I don't, personally, but I show up occasionally when races are held in the VDR series at Woodland, WA.  It looks like a really fun sport and there are some guys who are insanely fast on their machines.  One particular such guy was aboard a 400 CZ at Woodland last time I was there and just flying, with power-slides and the whole bit.

On a sort-of related note, I've been reading a book called "Monkey Butt!" by Rick "Super Hunky" Sieman.  It chronicles the old days of motorcycle-journalism with magazines like Dirt Bike and MXA right when they were getting started.  The book is really funny and has a lot of interesting history on the war over public land use that's been going on for the last 30 years or so.  If you're interested in older bikes, it's definitely something to check out!

[JohnN]

Hey JETZcorp,

Vintage racing is what got me back into motocross. I had "retired" many times and would come back to race "just one more race" for years. Finally I got involved with music and other things to stay away from the races.

A buddy kept asking me to go watch the vintage races, I finally "broke" down and went. It was such a blast! Not just because it was old bikes (although some were cool to see, quite a few looked very painful to ride!) but because the guys competing were laid back and interested in having a good time.

It was great because the race day was finished by 4pm! You could pack up and drive home in daylight, many times getting home before dark!

But racing a vintage bike takes a certain kind of person. You have to like the old bikes, of course, but you have to be happy with the rules of the class that you compete in.

Personally I like the technology advances that have occurred over the years. Bikes handle so much better, have better power and the brakes really work great! I like riding the new machines. I may not be as fast as I once was, but I have a blast.

As for Monkey Butt, I've recommended it to a bunch of folks. Hearing some of Super Hunky's stories is a blast.

A few of my favorites were wrestling Big Daddy Roth to get advertising for the fledgling Dirt Bike magazine, then the story of Bob Hannah offering him a ride up a big long hill to get back to his truck.

Never apologize for any thread if it's something about bikes and you like it. As long as you want to share it, do it. No matter what anyone thinks!

Thanks!

[Out of Order]

Well my first 125 was a 1983 Suzuki RM125, and it took me a little while to get used to because the bike was 2 years older than me. But you know what, I respect the men who rode them because it did take balls to ride them things. That bike (a.) was fast as hell to me (b.) brakes were drums, so there wasn't much stopping power compared to the latest and greatest discs (c.) Suspension was not good for triples. But it taught me to respect the machine, because it took special people to ride them. I would like to ride a Maico 440 one day though.

[JohnN]

Out of Order

You jumped triple jumps with a 1983 Suzuki RM125?  If you did you are my new hero!!

The problem with some of the older bikes is that the frames didn't hold up then when the tracks were tamer than they are today. Although riding techniques have improved a great deal and that might have something to do with them being able to do stuff that would have been unthinkable in the past.

I had an opportunity to ride a 1977 Maico Adolph Weil Replica (at least I think I have the year right?? That was a long time ago.) That bike was so cool. It handled great and the motor although fast was controllable. I'm looking forward to testing a new 2010 Maico this year!

[Hondacrrider]

I started out on a 1984 xr 200, and though this isn't a motocross machine, i still rode it around a motocross track, breaking the footpegs off of it because I jumped it too high, but it was a great machine, probably the only four stroke I would ever buy again, mainly for it's tankishness(or bulletproofness), amazing gas mileage(I only wish my cr had fuel injection cuz, my trail rides really are cut shorter now), and idiot proofness, I taught a lot of my friends how to ride dirt bikes on the thing, and have gotten a few of my friends into the sport, and if I had've taught them on something newer and more powerful they probably would not have started riding

[Out of Order]

NO, it was small triples (30ft) we built down the road. I did jump a 110 ft triple at the local track on a 96 KX125 though. It made us feel better to tell our friends at school we were jumping triples on an old bike. To be honest the suspension sucked on the bike and the most I jumped was about 40ft, because I was scared sh!t less of hitting any thing bigger. But other than that, I was young and dumb then (about 7 years ago) and would do anything. Fun times

[Alec S]

I love vintage bikes and would like to ride them. But, at 6' 9" modern bikes are just much more comfortable for me to ride. I believe my old Pursang had a 32" seat height.

[JETZcorp]

Well, it depends on what you want to consider vintage.  A good evolution bike like my Husky is just as tall, if not taller, than the new ones.

As for the frames being built for tamer tracks, I don't buy that.  New tracks certainly look a lot more gnarly because riders seems to spend 75% of their time in the air, but that doesn't mean the old ones didn't beat the shit out of the equipment.  Take a look at some of the old videos from the Carlsbad USGP to see what I mean.  This was a day when there weren't jumps, as such, but they had that cruel, uncontrollable sort of roughness that just pounded on bikes and riders like jackhammers.  The suspension, though, had different requirements.  It was more tuned for taking bumps that were small (well, smaller than a house) and fast.  I still maintain that a modern bike would have a hell of a time trying to keep up with a 490 Maico on a track like that.

http://motorbikearchives.com/Video-Gallery/High-Resolution/1981-500cc-Motocross-USGP.html

Regarding the Maico, the Adolf Weil (AW) models were made in 1976 and 1977.  After that, they were totally changed and became my favorite, the Magnum series in '78 and '79.  After that were the Mega and the legendary Mega 2 in '80 and '81.  Then they went to the Alpha 1, and the Spider (and Sand Spider) after that.  Yeah, I'm a Maico freak.  440 Magnum is the bike I plan to buy next.

I can't wait to see what Maico pull out in 2010 model, though I don't think anyone will ever make a bike look as good as they did in '77-80.  The golden years!

[JohnN]

I was probably not clear on this one, it's not that the frames were built for tamer tracks. It's that they added long travel suspension to frames that started out with 3 or 4 inches of travel. For a time there were a bunch of bent and broken frames.

I agree 100% that the tracks of old were rougher than current day tracks.

My only disappointment is that motocross has lost it's truest sense and become a cross between Supercross and Freestyle. At one time is was man and machine against obstacles and challenging terrain, not a jumping contest. That's why one of my favorite MX tracks is Southwick.

It's a shame that they groom it so smooth now. It gets groomed after practice and during intermission. Are today's racers afraid of rough tracks? Do they need to have groomed tracks all the time?

The funny thing is that I have been there during vintage events in where the track at Southwick is rougher than during current Nationals. Too bad.

[Alec S]

John, Have you ever checked out Jolly Roger in NH? No gap jumps and a lot of elevation changes.

[compmoto]

being gravity impaired, I would look for "easier" tracks, with less "airtime" obstacles.Maybe I should stay in the woods...harescrambles are sorta "smoother"...now if I could just get my stamina up to snuff. What are the options for vintage mx in the east? I have a couple of bikes I could choose from, if the economy/government doesn't force me to sell 'em for whatever the market will bear... ACRMX? is that a series? or organization? I suppose I could do a search...

[Out of Order]

 I'd love to go to Southwick some day. My nearest track is Central Cycle Club in Plainfield, CT. I haven't been there in 7 years, but it was a supercross style track with alot of jumps. I admit I hated that track, jumps everywhere. After racing a couple times there I just stopped racing and did trail riding. It's fun when you don't have to race any one.

[JohnN]

I have not been to Jolly Roger, but have heard lots of great things about it. Maybe this summer??

There are a few options for vintage racing in the East depending on where you are located. ACRMX is one club that runs a vintage series in the Northeast. Here is the site http://www.acrmx.com There are also AHRMA events and some local races have vintage classes. So you have some options.

Central Valley has a boat load of jumps, I raced there once. I think I loosened a few fillings off some of them racing my vintage bike! I prefer tracks with fewer jumps. Although in it's defense the Central Valley jumps are not too scary.