YouTube Debates!

[JETZcorp]

I thought I'd check out some of the spin about the new KX450F, and couldn't help notice its kickstarter was about three feet long and had not one, but THREE 90-degree angles in it.  I pointed this out in the comments and noted, "Four-strokes, man, they're ridiculous."

Then, on comes a guy claiming that they're better, and off we go.  Here's the conversation so far.

JETZcorp:
What I want to know is, who's the bonehead that decided a bike needs not one, but THREE 90-degree angles in the kickstarter? At the same time, who decided that said kickstarter should be 16" long and made of? chicken wire?

Four-strokes, man, they're ridiculous.

rcowner12:
what he means is its ridiculous how? much more powerful they are than 2 strokes...

JETZcorp
If someone showed up there with an open-class two-stroke, everyone there would shit their pants. Maico's new (meaning year 1999) 500 two-stroke makes 67 horsepower at the crank. I want you to find me ONE single-cylinder 4T that can do that. Just one. ? Should be easy, right?

A 4T will only have more power for one or more of the following reasons:
- It has a turbocharger.
- It has a supercharger.
- The AMA allows them to cheat.

Take that away and the 2T will have half-again the power of a 4T.

MonkeyManFsU:
2T are bad, there? not used by the pro's anymore for a reason. To inconsistant, not enough useable power, and the worst is the annoying sound

JETZcorp:
You think the professional racers get to choose what bike they ride? Oh man, that's hilarious. And as for inconsistent power, you've obviously never ridden a Maico. The power delivery from that is pure butter, with no hiccups or inconsistencies to be found. It feels like a 4T but with a lot? more top-end. Or rather, a 4T that actually HAS top-end.

Going back to the pros, you might want to take a look at what Stewart and Carmichael ride for fun. It's YZ250 and RM250, respectively.

MonkeyManFsU:
Your last statement is impecable and agrees with me, pros use 4t for a reason. 2T are way unreliable, when I had an kx85 the bike's engine (the thning that makes the bike go) broke 6 times. Transmission 1, top end rebuild 4, And bottom end rebuild 1. So we sold it got a mans bike (CRF150R) I clear 90 ft tables with no problem, had the bike since 07 no problems. I use my bro's kx250f now but no way I would go back to a 2T. A 250 2T doesnt even compare to our kx250f.? Hasnt broke either

JETZcorp:
My 1967 Kawasaki 120 (two-stroke) is 42 years old and still runs the original piston, and I can guarantee it got 100 miles put on it every weekend of the summer for five years straight. The only maintenance we did was to replace the oil and tweak the clutch. I don't know what could possibly have happened to your KX85; perhaps you weren't using? enough oil.

Ricky and Bubba both rode 4T professionally because they were paid to. The factories like 4T because the profit margin is greater.


What will happen next?

[westsiderippa]

this goes back to the original problem... your arguing with, what obviously sounds like a 14 y/o who has know clue and has been brain washed. also sounds like he cant ride. any of the kids i know, my friends sons, kids at my local track etc.. all the true tallanted naturally fast kids are on 85's. the kids that go straight from 65's to super mini 150's dont impress me with there riding abillity or style. its an improper step. you take a kid through the proper steps, i.e. 50, 65, 85, 125, then now 250 2t. his skills will far surpass if he was to go straight to the 4t. i have seen it with my own eyes. dont get me wrong im making a majority group assumption here. there are kids that rip on 150's but for the most part the ones who stick to the 2t develop better riding skills and its way easier on there dads wallet, lol. and as for this kids 2t that kept breaking, ha!! im sure he was paying for it with his summer job right. its a 2t you need to change the top end. you run any race bike hard enough you will break stuff. but when he breaks his 4t for the "first time" he will be crying when his dad says, well son this is going to take a while as i dont have 1000 bucks to fix it right now, guess we should have kept that old 85 around for you.

[JETZcorp]

Newest Post!

MonkeyManFsU:
And those pro riders were paid to ride for suzuki and yamaha not 4T, a localist (Bobby Fitch) had a choice to ride 2T's and 4T's. He chose 4T and got picked up from RDP (Who gave? him his bike's)

YouTube restricts me to 500 characters (you may have noticed my replies have been between 480-500 characters) so I want these to be as dense and effective as possible.  Ideas?  Anecdotes or sources refuting his claims?  Let's roast the little turkey.

[Recovered]

You are engaged in a battle of wits with folk who have none. These are one of the groups of posers I spoke about. A moron who had an unreliable 2T but switched to a 4T and never even puts fuel in it! Still runs on showroom fuel. And he says he switched to a CRF150, a notoriuosly UN-reliable bike. Hopefully its now late enough (1:11am where I am) that his mommie has fed, burped and diapered her little bundle of joy and put him into bed. 

[MMS]

Never get into an arguement with an idiot, they just drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

Often said but totally relevant nonetheless.

[ford832]

The biggest thing I gather from that conversation is a huge generation gap ;DAlthough I almost spewed coffee all over the screen when he said he got "a mans bike-a crf150" Hahahaha,that still makes me laugh.I agree,though.Arguing with a kid of this type is a useless exercise.A demo would likely be the best thing.Strap him on to a girly 500 2t and see how he does

[metal_miracle]

I ride a tm85  a 2stroke

rode it as much as i could
then the coolant hose rippe because of previous owner
leaking all coolant wide open throttle  it was like a steam engine coming down the hill.

noting had happend so i rode a 2nd year on that piston (meshured some play in the con rod over tolerance)


2 years after that the carb rubber  ripped sucked in sand  put in 
replaced  piston and crank bearings

1 year later the connecting rod gave up  i can still use the cylinder but piston and con rod bearing got it


I like to think if it had been a 4stroke it would have been a parts bike by now


3 piston changes in 5 years isnt bad and 300 plus hours on a crank

[KXwestYZ]

Newest Post!

MonkeyManFsU:
And those pro riders were paid to ride for suzuki and yamaha not 4T, a localist (Bobby Fitch) had a choice to ride 2T's and 4T's. He chose 4T and got picked up from RDP (Who gave? him his bike's)

YouTube restricts me to 500 characters (you may have noticed my replies have been between 480-500 characters) so I want these to be as dense and effective as possible.  Ideas?  Anecdotes or sources refuting his claims?  Let's roast the little turkey.

Tell him they only ride 4 strokes cos they have been given at least 85% engine size advantage!!! tell him in the UK MCF Red Bull Pro Nationals where there are no unfair displacement advanages given to 4 strokes the majority of riders are on 2 strokes!!!

[JohnN]

Jetzcorp - you are fighting a losing battle of wits with those that have very little to spare!! You're a brave man!

I've found that the only way that you can talk to these folks is to show some proof.... you now like racers winning on "inferior" antique two-strokes....

Although that probably will do little or nothing for the children that post on You Tube.....

Good luck!!

Let us know if you make any headway.

[AFG]

Jetzcorp I am impressed. Your arguments are lucid and well thought out, problem is you are arguing with someone who has no intention of looking at things from another perspective. This individual doesn't want to confuse the issue with facts.  The good news is his village called and they want him back. Keep up the good work.

[Out of Order]

So we sold it got a mans bike (CRF150R) I clear 90 ft tables with no problem, had the bike since 07 no problems.

The only triples this kid does is at Wendys. And the POS CRF150 a mans bike, what a laugh. The only problem he has is with himself, if he would stop eating triples he wouldn't have this problem.

This stupid kid should read Mad Scientists "The state of it" then he would look differently upon the AMA and pro riders.