Rumours,Rumours!

[miedosoracing]

Alittle confused to say the least.  Those are Honda's.  According to other pages, they have all sorts of bikes in Spain, that are being made with Honda info. http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.motoocasionpro.com/ads/hm-crm-125-2t-derapage-competition-2011/&ei=NyvJTcL6JeLx0gHNuMmSCQ&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CDUQ7gEwAw&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhm%2Bcrm125%2B2011%26hl%3Den%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-US%26rlz%3D1I7DKUS_en%26prmd%3Divns

http://www.motorbikes.be/en/HM_CRM_125R_2007.aspx

[ACMX]

Those are pretty cool bikes. If you wanted a 2011 'Honda' that would be your place to buy. But I don't think anything would beat the real deal.

[miedosoracing]

So seems kinda like a service honda dealio. They get bikes and make them into new bikes?  The supermotos are cool. $2999 euro's. Wonder how much here.  Wish that sold here.

[viking24]

I think you're beating a dead horse 2t institute.It reminds me of arguing all the reasons why an airplane will never fly.
BRP has already done it-the end.As bioflex says,it remains to be seen whether anyone will put it into production.Maybe BRP will do a dirt bike,under the Can Am name.That's certainly feasible if they see a market.
For all you who don't want to see it happen,you better hope it-or something else,does or I expect in a few short years you can kiss your 2t dirt bikes goodbye.

Been enjoying this thread...I had not to long ago spoken with a engine tuner friend about the DI issue. He told me how BRP built a 300cc DI 2T ATV to test and compare against the current 450 4T performance offering. It apparently out performed the 4T in every catagory and all test riders chose the 2T over the 4T. In the end, the brass said no because of consumer perception. So does BRP have the golden egg or perhaps even the goose.

[viking24]

Here it is, The new Honda.

EFI 2 Stroke.

What kind of bike is that? There are two different ones, because the one with red anodizing triples etc isn't too bad. I'd buy a bike like that to commute.     Italian?  Colors on number plates is why I ask.

Pretty sure these are Hero Motorcycles. They had used Honda based engines. I thought I remember reading Honda broke ties with them a few years ago.

[miedosoracing]

Not sure, Hero isn't showing any 2 strokes and is a India based setup looks like. HM is coming up as spanish stuff.  Very interesting and would like to know more.

[metal_miracle]

Thats  HONDA-motesa think its a Spanish honda factory

[TMKIWI]

Sorry for the wind up guys.
The bike is a HM from Italy.
Quote stolen from site I found this from.

Honda do not make any 2 stroke engines any more.

The HM CRE are actually bikes from motocross of Honda (the CR ) that once imported into Italy are prepared by the importer to HM 's enduro Europe. Infatti la sigla HM deriva dall' acronimo di Honda - Montesa . In fact, derives from the initials HM ' stands for Honda - Montesa .

The CRE, with two-stroke engine , were built in different sizes, just cross the models approved for the enduro.

. There is also a version built in Italy 50 cc call HM CRE 50 .
There are also models supermotard that differ in several details, which only in the 50 cc version were called Derapage and since 2007 have changed their name in CRM, while the higher capacity versions were called "Motard".

by 2008 only the CRE 50 has remained in production until 2010, in 2011 there is the return of a second displacement.

After a period where he left off in just the motorcycle production in 2011 was put into production at the 125 (presented at ' EICMA in 2010. In this new edition is equipped with the ECS of Dell'Orto (previously used by the Cagiva Mito and by ' Aprilia RS 125 ) with a Rotax engine block, otherwise it has the structure of the CRE 50 with slight differences for the suspension, The motion also adopts a cooling fan placed at the top right of the radiator, you also have the opportunity to enjoy two engine maps selectable from the handlebars.
The ECS used for this motion is characterized by various sensors, an indicator to signal a malfunction and an electronic oil pump, the exhaust valve just like the Aprilia is used to model the fixed and mobile for the weakened Model ? full power III.
The difference between the model and the Baja competition is that it does not use the mixer and the oil tank, but is powered by a gasoline-oil mixture, it also has double radiator, an ' expansion different and that even though the clutch cable has a hydraulically operated, this oil because it uses a drive-wire at the entrance of glazed paper.
Not a very good translation.

[miedosoracing]

Alright! so where's a Italian two stroker to import these suns of beaches     I'll take the supermoto 125 with fuel injection. I'll ride it every day to work.

[yo_marc]

Dumb question.  With DI, how does the 2T bottom end get lubrication?

[yo_marc]

Ahhhhh.....

"But DI can pose some lubrication challenges. Oil is still drawn in from the bottom of the cylinder but fuel is injected from the top. Since the fuel and oil don't mix, the oil isn't thinned sufficiently to move up and lubricate the top piston ring. That's a recipe for engine disaster-as one manufacturer has discovered.

Yamaha's HPDI system gets around this problem with a new, patented bottom piston ring that's made with a taper for oil bypass every 30 degrees. The 12 tapered areas around the ring allow sufficient oil to reach and lubricate the top ring."

http://www.popularmechanics.com/outdoors/recreation/boating/1276871

[EJ]

Oh my oh my...
A 125 2stroke Honda (altho under the name of Italian HM) with new Austrian Rotax 2 stroke technology.
Aprilia should have used this engine in the current RS125, insted of that 125 4 stroke...
I expect this engine also in go-karts, as the rotax 125 engine is very popular in karting.
Perhaps Aprilia will use this engine in their next years SX/RX 125. But for now, they still use the carbed Rotax 125.

[TMKIWI]

Dumb question.  With DI, how does the 2T bottom end get lubrication?

You need an oil tank & pressure pump.
With no fuel running through the crankcase to wash off the oil you dont need as much oil.
Pressure pump supplys oil to the crank journals just like a 4 stroke ( oil gallerys to the big end & little end ) and also the ring using a nozzle in the side of the cylinder. You can also bleed a bit of oil into the fuel so it is injected into the combustion chamber.
Any excess oil is recirculated from the bottom of the crankcase using the crankcase pulses and a simple vacum pump and sent back to lubrication system.

[bearorso]

It's not any sort of DFI, or EFI. Just Dell'Ortos ECS - Electronic Carburetor System.

The ECS is just a Carb with some electrical components. I think  a CV type unit with an electric oil pump / solenoid for auto lube, and a few other things, perhaps an electronic power jet. And I think the PV is simply opened by a solenoid, whilst still having some sort of diaphragm like the first Rotax PV set ups., and the Maico PV set up. Huskies Euro market WR125 - a DS version of the real WR125 uses this as well, as do a variety of road legal bikes and scooters.

[citabjockey]

ETec! Want ETec! 1/2 of a 150 HP SkiDoo 2TDI 800.
70HP for a 400cc would be quite nice in a new KTM frame!

And would be clean enough for green sticker in California.