lil rumor

[MCGRIDDLE_321]

imagine if the 2012 looked like this. i would do anything to have this bike. SO NICE!!

honda cr 250 afs (alu frame special)

[miedosoracing]

Ford, I'm one of those who believes my 2002-07 chassis 2 strokes were the best handling bikes I've ever owned.  If you know anything about me, you know I've owned well over a couple hundred bikes, since that is what I do. My bikes do ruts better than any bike I've ridden. I could never go in, gas it, and hope to keep the front end inside without feeling like I was gonna fall. These bikes handle perfectly.  It is exactly why i haven't built a new 2010 or new framed CR, like the post above this. I don't know if it would be better.  I don't see how, since those bikes were designed for 4 strokes.  2nd, Honda's are very reliable. It is crazy to say they aren't.  Yamaha's, kawi's, Suzuki's etc are all less reliable in my history of owning them.  I don't know yet about KTM.  I have been chomping, but still alittle nervous about getting one.  Someday soon, my guess.  Now, I regress, I am anti-Honda now, because they stopped producing and actually pushed for the no 2 strokes. But to say they don't handle great and aren't reliable is just crazy.   

[ford832]

Handling is a personal thing.If you like them,great.Most have issues with the balance and harshness though different years are different of course.My main point was build quality.With Honda,you have to talk 4t because that's all they sell now.The 250's were plagued with reliability issues.The example of my buddies CRF simply states fact and I stayed away from the engine issues he had simply because that's typical 4t,regardless of brand.For the 2t's,though they made a decent woods bike,the case reed engine was a dog compared to others.
The early aluminum frames were horrific and the suspension would jar your fillings.
I'm not saying Honda is a pos nor that they haven't built a quality,good performing motorcycle.What I am saying is that,like any others-though maybe not so much as some-they have poor design issues,build quality issues and reliability issues as well.
The Honda faithful are the only I group I know who religiously tout their machinery as being the holy grail of quality and reliability when evidence to the the contrary is staring them right in the face.
I've had them before and currently own a Honda quad and am quite happy with it.On the other hand,maybe it's just my sh!thouse luck that the Honda's I've owned have had issues just like every other brand I've owned.It figures I'd be the guy that would end up with the only 6 Honda's ever built that weren't perfect.  

[SachsGS]

I've raced lots of Hondas and would take a Maico or other euro bike over one any day.I haven't ridden the 01 CR250 (last of the piston ports) and I liked the 92 Mcgrath flexy flier but I definately prefer Maico handling over Honda.As well ,in terms of reliability issues,Honda has produced more the a few dogs over the years and with 35 plus years in the industry I can Yamaha has the best reliability record for Japanese machines.Just compare ATV's - I own a 660 Grizzly and have repaired just about every Honda ATV in the village (chronic shift mechanism problems).

A friend is a Honda automotive technician and has told me that the quality of Honda automobiles has slipped significantly in recent years.

[hack-man162]

The 1st gen Honda aluminum frame was crap.  Ask McGrath.  He chose to go ride that PoS RM in '97 instead of staying with Honda.  They got a lot better though through the years.  Give me a good, light ChroMo frame any day over aluminum though.

What I would LOVE to do someday, is build a custom frame, based on my YZ's dimensions, out of ChroMo and with a Full-Floater rear end.  Now THAT would be sweet!

EDIT: On second thought, I'd need to do this with an RM.  Anyone have an '06-'08 RM 250 they want to donate to get this project started?

[ACMX]

I want that 125

[TMKIWI]

The Honda faithful are the only I group I know who religiously tout their machinery as being the holy grail of quality and reliability when evidence to the the contrary is staring them right in the face.
 

I 2nd that.
Honda quads are big over here but people seem to ignore the stater motor issues when saying how good they are.
Remember the XR250RE ?. What a dog. Cracked heads within 10 hours.
Timming chain issues on the smaller xr's 100-185 etc.
I know sum Honda fanatics who just wont except that Honda has made anything bad.
Well they have, and so has every other manufactor.
Toyota get the same praise as well, some deserved some not.
I have never been a big Toyota fan ( no particular reason ) more of a Nissan fan, but find myself now driving 2 Toyotas.
I am not brand loyal I just buy what floats my boat at the time.
In the last 4 years i have had a Kawasaki/Suzuki/Yamaha/KTM/Honda/TM.

Point is there is no such thing as a perfect manufactor

[snook620]

The Honda faithful are the only I group I know who religiously tout their machinery as being the holy grail of quality and reliability when evidence to the the contrary is staring them right in the face.

Could you post some links to this evidence since its staring us in the face? I cant seem to find anything. And for the record Im not a Honda guy, Im speaking from my own personal experience with everything from Honda lawnmowers to cars. Everything they build is quality

[ktm150rippa]

ask a honda 4 stroke owner how they feel about their valve quality. Out of all they jap bikes other than kawi honda feel super cheap to me but I have personal issues with them so I'm sure that clouds my judgement.

[ruskee]

we have honda 4 wheelers that are 11 years old and been flipped in ponds and have had one ol change there entire lifes run great still

[ruskee]

ask a honda 4 stroke owner how they feel about their valve quality. Out of all they jap bikes other than kawi honda feel super cheap to me but I have personal issues with them so I'm sure that clouds my judgement.

my neghibor bought an 04 crf 450 it ran good first couple of hours then the valves went he adjusted rode prolly 2 hours and he now needs new valves

[miedosoracing]

I personally speak of 2 strokes.  I hope the honda 4 strokes are POS's.  Just that much better in my opinion. The faster they break, the less someone will buy another one.  I am merely speaking of the 2 stroke Hondas being good handling and built well. Power can be argued round and round.  My CR250 03 ran every bit as good as any other bike out there, but I did do some things that no one else does.  It wasn't the case induction, I've figured out the problem. Honda just made them slow for some reason. It's interesting that the years they got slower, the 4 strokes started exploding.   Just sayin. RC's bike was fast and was case induction. Its a fact, that Honda's hold more resale than Suzuki etc.  Why is that?  2002 CR250 will run around $1800 still in these parts.  I can pick up a KX or RM for around $1400.  Honda has name recognition, of building quality.  Maybe they'll spend all they won over the years (karma's a beach).  I know KTM is coming on strong. 

[TMKIWI]

I know of 2 CRF450X's that have split their right hand crankcases.
Reason. Flat battery.
When you try and kick start them the kick start boss and idler gear have been weakend to reduce weight.
Result. Broken idler and crank case.

[ford832]

The Honda faithful are the only I group I know who religiously tout their machinery as being the holy grail of quality and reliability when evidence to the the contrary is staring them right in the face.

Could you post some links to this evidence since its staring us in the face? I cant seem to find anything. And for the record Im not a Honda guy, Im speaking from my own personal experience with everything from Honda lawnmowers to cars. Everything they build is quality

Are you serious?You haven't been living in a cave for the last 10 yrs have you? Lol,ok,but it's the weekend so kitchen painting is on the agenda so I'll have to get back at it later.
A couple notes before I get at it,

1. I've worked on cars for a living for the past 25 yrs so I have a fair idea of what breaks on what brands and how often.
2. As I've already said a couple of times,Honda generally makes good stuff but to say they haven't built dogs,ticking time bombs or machinery that is poorly designed/executed is retarded.
3. What bothers me most about the 4t revolution isn't the engine itself but what trickled in to the 2t line because of it.
For years,2t's were at or about their weight limit so they stayed about the same.With the advent of the 4t MX,because the engines are so much heavier,everything else has been lightened up in order to compensate.Many of these parts also went on to the 2t's and imo,to the point of fragility.
4. I'll be back with your links later 

[miedosoracing]

Are you serious?You haven't been living in a cave for the last 10 yrs have you? Lol,ok,but it's the weekend so kitchen painting is on the agenda so I'll have to get back at it later.
A couple notes before I get at it,

1. I've worked on cars for a living for the past 25 yrs so I have a fair idea of what breaks on what brands and how often.
2. As I've already said a couple of times,Honda generally makes good stuff but to say they haven't built dogs,ticking time bombs or machinery that is poorly designed/executed is retarded.
3. What bothers me most about the 4t revolution isn't the engine itself but what trickled in to the 2t line because of it.
For years,2t's were at or about their weight limit so they stayed about the same.With the advent of the 4t MX,because the engines are so much heavier,everything else has been lightened up in order to compensate.Many of these parts also went on to the 2t's and imo,to the point of fragility.
4. I'll be back with your links later 

Yes ford, please post the actual comparisons from all manufacturers of reliablity.  I'm sure there are magazine articles etc.  Not just joe smoes opinions. Actual comparisons professionally done.