Two Stroke Motocross

Two Stroke Motocross Forum => General Two Stroke Talk => Topic started by: JW400 on May 03, 2012, 12:01:08 AM

Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: JW400 on May 03, 2012, 12:01:08 AM: Hey everyone, I'm currently researching options for my new ride. I currently have an 06 YZ250 with a completely rebuilt motor, VForce 3 reeds, FMF SST pipe and Powercore 2 silencer, but i feel the bike as whole is on its last leg. Thus, why i am looking for some more input. I have ridden a "big 4" brand my whole life and have never even been on a KTM. But the KTM is $400 cheaper than the YZ and comes stock with some pretty sweet stuff (VForce3, hydraulic clutch, etc). But my concerns lie in the fact that I have ZERO experience with a KTM. Any input would be greatly appreciated!
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: scooter042 on May 03, 2012, 12:51:27 AM: I have owned several of each and own an 07 YZ now. I will not be buying another YZ again. The 250SX has a hydro clutch which had me spoiled. I still cant believe there is a clutch that is THAT much better than the big 4 stuff and they stilllll havent caught on yet. The SX is FASTER while still being EASIER to ride somehow. The SX HANDLES BETTER by a long shot. The SX has does not need $700 worth of upgrades as soon as you buy it. To me there is no comparison. I got this YZ on a deal, but I would easily pay more for an SX than a YZ. If the SX is less then to me there is NO decision to be made.

Get the SX. you will NOT regret it.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: Recovered on May 03, 2012, 01:01:39 AM: i am rebuilding a KTM now from the nut/bolt level. I can say a lot of the differences are refreshing and make the Japanese bikes look like junk. i haven't ridden this 125SX yet, but based on building it from teh ground up, I already know I will stay Euro unless something earth shattering comes out of Japan real soon.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: cnrcpla on May 03, 2012, 01:07:32 AM: I am a Yamaha fan, but there isn't really much of a difference between the 06 and 12... Just take that into consideration.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: factoryX on May 03, 2012, 01:12:45 AM: KTM over Yamaha any day.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: TMKIWI on May 03, 2012, 01:27:13 AM: 1 horse race.
KTM by a long shot.

And its cheaper.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: racer142 on May 03, 2012, 02:03:42 AM: Sounds very similar to a local guy story here. U from the Memphis tn area? The only problem with ktm's in this area is part availability. I've known a few guys that had to wait a week or more for simple parts. This was before motosport was an oem dealer so it might be easier no but it's something to consider. The ktm is a better bike overall but the yz has a better suspension and more part availability.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: ford832 on May 03, 2012, 02:04:30 AM: Not so fast.If it were me,I'd be thinking it over long and hard.The YZ is a quality machine that will last as long or longer than any KTM.That said,the KTM has some cool goodies and odds and sods on it-and is a quality machine as well.
The YZ has more power than you'd ever need but the KTM has that much more again.
What the YZ has that the KTM lacks is suspension.The YZ's SSS suspension is still regarded as the best in the business-the KTM's is regarded as being better than previous years but nothing to write home about.
The KTM engine in the YZ frame would be a good start.
I'd be happy with either but would probably take the YZ.Don't listen to all the hokey crap about the "old" Yamaha design.There is no new technology the KTM has that the YZ doesn't-or the last years of CR's,KX's or RM's for that matter.Many people seem to equate new plastic with new technology.
FWIW,I never had any problems with parts availability on any of my KTM's or Berg.If anything,they were faster and cheaper than my Yamaha's.I think it depends more on your dealer than anything.
It's a push imo.This is a good read and somewhat compares the two......
http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CDIQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmotocrossactionmag.com%2FMain%2FNews%2FMXAS-2012-YAMAHA-YZ250-MOTOCROSS-TEST-NOT-EVERYONE-8839.aspx&ei=cS2jT5aJMYjhggeb7aQ5&usg=AFQjCNFvpNsRUo9EQh80sBwX1zexAsLKNQ&sig2=dNflPl_IbBCKvZ6T4nXdgQ
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: msmola2002 on May 03, 2012, 03:38:26 AM: Silly question - can you get a KTM?

They only imported 250? of the things. A friend got what was allegedly the last one in the northeast, and that order was placed quite a few months back, and had to wait 8-10 weeks for it to arrive.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: msambuco on May 03, 2012, 04:02:31 AM: And with all that good advice let me add a little question you need to ask yourself. Can you really use all the power the KTM has. On my 08 YZ250 I put on a Pro Circuit pipe. Definitly faster, probably picked up 2HP, maybe a little more when it came on the pipe. Of course i liked it. Well 2 weeks later I squished the new pipe. Good thing the stocker was in the camper. You know what I found out? I was way faster with the more managable stock power. My suspension helps me go faster than any power mod ever could. I am one of the average riders and thats how it works out for me. If you are one of those faster guys, get the high powered KTM because any difference in suspension capabilities will be nill just because of the talent riding the bike. Be honest with yourself and then get the bike that fits. Ryan Blizzard clearly belongs on the KTM, not the YZ.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: riffraff on May 03, 2012, 04:28:36 AM: $400 cheaper! oem goodies! 'nuff said!
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: Super Trucker on May 03, 2012, 05:17:22 AM: You only have 2 choices buying new, YZ has the best forks,preditible handling, do it all motor. The SX strong motor, hydro clutch- I,m not a believer,nothing wrong with a reg. clutch, gold chain- chains wear out, weird feeling on the ktm. There,s low hr used 05-07 250,s out there the KX once ya get the chasis balanced,install a diff. linkage arm,is a great 250, the RM has a great motor, suspension is close to the yz, quick handling bike, rm feel loose and wore out after 40 hrs tho. The cr250 has the best chasis by far,the most important thing next to suspension,which is balanced but not quite as good as the yz sss, just mid range for power tho, toughest trans and clutch, needs reed valve or motor work. I would look for a 05-07 cr250, tune the motor to your liking, after 200 hrs the cr still feels like a new bike.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: TMKIWI on May 03, 2012, 06:03:18 AM: He is after a new bike ST.
Both the YZ & KTM have good motors.
You don't have to piss around fixing the engine like Honda should have.

And there are 3 choices new. TM
And in 6 months Husky will have their new 250.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: JW400 on May 03, 2012, 06:48:37 AM: Wow, those are all pretty valid points. I like the YZ bc that's what im used to and what I know. As far as availability, I think im gonna struggle trying to find any brand new 2t. The KTM sounds good with the better motor and clutch but its hard to beat top level suspension. Im really looking for something that hits real hard down low and will have me asking myself "do I have enough room to make it through 3rd?" Also, I want something that corners real well, my YZ doesn't seem to sit down in a line. Just trying to figure out if its better to go with something I know or take a gamble on something thats advertised as being pretty sweet.

Btw, no I am not from Memphis, TN lol, Grand Rapids, MI actually
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: twosmoke595 on May 03, 2012, 07:00:16 AM: Quote from: JW400 on May 03, 2012, 01:48:37 PM
Wow, those are all pretty valid points. I like the YZ bc that's what im used to and what I know. As far as availability, I think im gonna struggle trying to find any brand new 2t. The KTM sounds good with the better motor and clutch but its hard to beat top level suspension. Im really looking for something that hits real hard down low and will have me asking myself "do I have enough room to make it through 3rd?" Also, I want something that corners real well, my YZ doesn't seem to sit down in a line. Just trying to figure out if its better to go with something I know or take a gamble on something thats advertised as being pretty sweet.

Btw, no I am not from Memphis, TN lol, Grand Rapids, MI actually

honestly you get your suspension dialed in on the yz and it turns really well
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: VintageBlueSmoke on May 03, 2012, 09:29:35 AM: When it comes to "being used to"...it makes no difference. A bike is a bike. You will find just as many "little" differences between your '12 YZ as you would going Orange.

Getting the KTM, none of your spares will fit. Getting the Yamaha, only 1/2 your spares will fit - and probably not the ones you want.

Yamaha has better suspension but it has an Aluminum frame. (you all know my dislike for aluminum frames)

Here is what I found was the most important issue when considering a new bike: Dealer Support.
If you are buddies with your local dealer, get a 'fair' deal there, they stock or can get your parts quickly, are knowledgable on your model and in your sport - buy that bike. If you are 200 miles from the nearest dealer, and he is a jerk, and you need a part - you are going to miss the race and then blame the bike manufacturer for not anticipating this problem.

I want a dealer who races. I want a dealer I can call on Friday night and say "I need 'x' part, can you bring it to the races Sunday?" Then not have to worry about the bill until Tuesday. Or even better, one that anticipates problems..."Johnny, I got a flat, you got a Tube?" "Sure Kurt." or "Steve, I grabbed the wrong spark plugs, the ones for my Penton. You got a plug for the KTM?" and I get the answer..."Sure Kurt."

The differences between a Yamaha, KTM, Husqvarna, Suzuki, TM, or Beta are so small and unimportant that it just comes down to support and choice of color. Oh and one more thing...

...With the KTM, you'll need new riding gear.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: eprovenzano on May 03, 2012, 01:49:40 PM: Quote from: VintageBlueSmoke on May 03, 2012, 04:29:35 PM

...With the KTM, you'll need new riding gear.

Good thought vintage, I'd hate to be caught wearing blue gear on a pumkin bike...
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: Stusmoke on May 03, 2012, 01:59:47 PM: They're both pure bred four stroke eaters but personally I would go with the KTM. Between KTM actually supporting the 2 stroke cause, absolute monstrous brakes, a weapon of a motor and coming forward with their suspension by leaps and bounds I'd go the KTM. As opposed to the YZ which hasnt changed since 2005. Not to mention the 7 or so grand you spend on that bike goes straight into yamahas Four joke programs
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: chump6784 on May 04, 2012, 11:34:05 AM: Just weigh up the strengths of each,
KTM - better engine, better brakes and better chassis
Yamaha - better suspension. On the suspension I believe Yamaha is the only manufacturer that uses the SSS suspension, get the KTM set up with the right valving and springs for your weight and speed as you would with any bike the KTM is on par with the rest of the Jap bikes anyway.

If it were me i know which one i would pick
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: citabjockey on May 04, 2012, 02:02:28 PM: Quote from: eprovenzano on May 03, 2012, 08:49:40 PM
Quote from: VintageBlueSmoke on May 03, 2012, 04:29:35 PM
...With the KTM, you'll need new riding gear.
Good thought vintage, I'd hate to be caught wearing blue gear on a pumkin bike...

This is not a problem. I never let color coordination get in the way of going riding.
Well, maybe a little. Actually updating gear every couple of decades is generally a good idea...
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: JW400 on May 04, 2012, 03:48:45 PM: Ive always known that the KTM has had a MONSTER of a motor, the suspension has me worried though. Since they moved from the PDS to the linkage, im wondering if they've taken all of the jap gains and used them to bring their stuff up to par? It would be hard to leave the SSS behind, but at this point, im willing to try anything to get a bike to corner fairly well. The braking power of the KTM would also be a plus. Idk if its just cause my bike is 6yrs old or what, but my front brake seems non-existant compared to my brothers 08 YZ and the SX comes with oversized rotors.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: SachsGS on May 05, 2012, 05:49:19 AM: The future is the KTM.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: Stusmoke on May 05, 2012, 12:39:10 PM: Quote from: SachsGS on May 05, 2012, 12:49:19 PM
The future is the KTM.

Pretty much hey. They're good, reliable, very fast and look hot. Not to mention so many people have had it with dumping 5 grand into their engine every couple of seasons they want two strokes and KTM make the best
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: rocrac on May 07, 2012, 02:07:17 AM: 2012 KTM 250 owner and wrench for a fast mx A rider. I couldn't bring myself to spend that kind of money for 7 year old technology with the YZ. Superior brakes, clutch, Vforce reed valve, excell rims, adjustable power valve, on the fly ignition mapping, adjustable bar mounts this list goes on. This bike flat out rips and if you're not up to the power changing the power charactoristics is a flip of a switch or a couple 8 mil bolts. The suspension, like all suspensions need to re-valved and sprung to your weight and riding abilities I would make sure you deal with someone who knows WP . I would reccomend speaking to Bo Babbit at Cycle Specialties in GA if he doesn't have one he may be able to find one for you. His son russell races off road and they understand/appreciate racing. Good luck either way...go 2 strokes.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: motoman356 on May 07, 2012, 07:12:03 AM: go with a KTM. you start off with more power and a better chassis. susp isnt bad and can be tuned. plus KTM actually reinvests that money into the two stroke program. i dont know what yamaha with their money cuz the two strokes are 6yrs old and the YZF's dont get much tuning.
Title: 2012 250SX or 2012 YZ250
Post by: MetalMike1982 on May 07, 2012, 02:22:09 PM: I dont think KTM alone is the way of the future but euro bikes all together . Seems like the bergs, gasgas,TM and Husky's are pretty nice bikes too .