Two Stroke Motocross
Two Stroke Motocross Forum => General Two Stroke Talk => Topic started by: JohnN on January 03, 2010, 01:05:43 PM
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Straight from Davey Coombs at MX Sports;
"Gang, sorry for a SPAM-like correction, but I just found out from the AMA's Supercross Series Director Kevin Crowther that there was a mistake in Friday's Racerhead #1 regarding polished frames. Ping reported that polishing frames is now illegal, but that is not the case. According to Kevin, the polishing of the frames was discussed but it was decided to not implement that rule for 2010. He added that the frame rule as a whole as well other technical changes will be discussed again this year as we prepare for 2011. The complete rulebook is available online at amasupercross.com
My apologies for not checking this out more, and sorry for any confusion it may have caused, I hope Ping gets the elbow grease out this week because he might have a lot of last-minute polishing to do at TLD!
DC
MX Sports "
We'll keep you up to date on the AMA's fluctuating rules as they come and go like the summer breeze. LOL ;D
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But, the AMA still considered it!
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Because it makes so much difference on the track... They can go polish their brains. This is embarrassing. I cannot wait for the next rule.
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As is typical for these clowns. A decision can't be made before getting the approval of seven different morons, two freaks from the market department and all "big 5" manufacturers. In a word.......PATHETIC. Make a damn rule change and let the chips fall.
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To clarify a bit, this rule was written about by Ping on Racerhead, for those who don't know he is the Race Team Manager for Troy Lee's Motocross Efforts.
My guess is that the rule was passed (probably by someone at the AMA because of a knee-jerk reaction) thne when it was "published" on the web and the 10 "Disciples" got wind of it, a stink was raised and they called the AMA and made them change the rule.
It was a dumb, needless rule, but it goes to show who is ruling the "roost" in Pro Racing.
The above is my opinion and no clowns were hurt in writing it. :P ;D
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Update from Ping on Racer X site..
"For the record, I got that information from a very reliable source at Pro Circuit. The rules state that NO material may be removed from the frame or swingarm and, believe me, there is material being removed from the frames of many race bikes. This rule was set to be enforced until very recently. Still... my bad. Sorry for the drama. Guess my guys have some "polishing" to do. "
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Just wondering, but why would they make a rule about not allowing race teams to polish their frames, I wouldn't think it would affect performance.
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2 reasons: more flex (something I don't care for) and less weight. The belief that aluminum frames are lighter than steel are bogus.
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at 245lbs the Yamaha YZ450F need a lot of grinding and polishing to match the 208 lbs of the KTM 250SX..LOL
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They use titanium everything. They can get the bikes very light. Did you know or ever wonder why there is a MINIMUM weight rule!?!? :o >:( :-[
Just another reason to stay up late at night and go HUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM.
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There is a rule about minimum weight, why?
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They use titanium everything. They can get the bikes very light. Did you know or ever wonder why there is a MINIMUM weight rule!?!? :o >:( :-[
Just another reason to stay up late at night and go HUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM.
The two stroke riders need to have change in their pockets? LOL Seriously, the AMA boards members should be treated like pedophiles in prison!
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There is a rule about minimum weight, why?
Because the factory's would use all titanium if they could and make a YZF450 weigh about 150 pounds. Even the frame and swing arm would be titanium, then the privateers would be ancient history.
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Just wondering, but why would they make a rule about not allowing race teams to polish their frames, I wouldn't think it would affect performance.
Just to clarify what the others have already said, before polishing some one could (hypothetically ;-) ) use a grinder and remove some of the aluminum from the frame before polishing. This would be done to lower weight (removing material makes things lighter) and to increase frame flex (something that Aluminum doesn't really like to do much of before breaking)
Remember that the people that would do something like this woud most likely replace the frame very often so as not to have stressed or broken frames.
This is something that can happen to an aluminum frame when stressed...
(http://twostrokemotocross.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/img_6630.jpg)
(http://twostrokemotocross.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/img_6635.jpg)
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^^^^ I've seen pictures of a aluminum frame 98 or 99 CR250 years ago that hit a pole in, I want to say New Zealand.
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What happened?? I mean after it hit the pole and all?
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Pretty much the same as the bike pictured but a little more banged up. To me it didn't seem like a lot of damage for hitting a pole at 80mph. I saw it in a magazine about 8-9 years ago.
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The picture is not that good, but...notice where it broke? They are designed to flexx at the steering head (and other places) to help them turn. That broke in a place where it is NOT supposed to flex. Also, it is very close to the heat affected zone from the weld. Either it wasn't heat treated, was heat treated incorrectly, or just like a paper clip, failed from poor design.
How many of these chassis' fracture when the pros ride them and we are not told about it? You can't magna-flux aluminum to inspect for fractures. You can use various spray-on inspection methods, with sometimes compromised results. If I owned a aluminum framed dirt bike (I won't) I would have a regular inspection schedule where I stripped the bike down to the frame and looked it over with a fine toothed comb. Then I would sell it. But that's just me :-X
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Just wondering, but why would they make a rule about not allowing race teams to polish their frames, I wouldn't think it would affect performance.
Just to clarify what the others have already said, before polishing some one could (hypothetically ;-) ) use a grinder and remove some of the aluminum from the frame before polishing. This would be done to lower weight (removing material makes things lighter) and to increase frame flex (something that Aluminum doesn't really like to do much of before breaking)
Remember that the people that would do something like this woud most likely replace the frame very often so as not to have stressed or broken frames.
This is something that can happen to an aluminum frame when stressed...
(http://twostrokemotocross.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/img_6630.jpg)
(http://twostrokemotocross.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/img_6635.jpg)
What a good way to shave some weight.. Just split the bike in half! This is also happening with the sportbikes.. scarry.
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Like the frames from KTM.
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/sethenslow/ktm-1.jpg)
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From what I have gathered about the number 60 bike that is in two pieces is that when the frame was modified it was either not heat treated or the weld was weak. From eye witness accounts, there was some space showing at the front of the frame before it broke in half.
The racer was Scott Elderfield and the bike was NOT a Service Honda. It was done in the UK.
Hey 2smoker... whats the deal with the 4 stroke KTM photo?? Is that on your wish list?? :P :P
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hahaha sure John! Like the Orange frame! This is it!
What about this one? (http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/sethenslow/parker-new-bike-2010.jpg)
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Personally, I feel like if the rules package was corrected, you could have companies like Service Honda (just to name one) that could develop their own frames, with updated geometry, and you could put any engine in it you would like. And it would still be AMA legal. Bikes would be safer.
I also KNEW the street bike frames were going to start failing!!.
I have a 600 Triumph and I can wheelie that thing as far as I want, and I'm working on my stoppies. The problem is getting the correct "touch" when setting the front wheel back down. You can bottom out the forks and send a terrific impact to the chassis. I don't want to die on that bike so I am cautious about that stuff.
And I only do wheelies and stoppies in off-road, closed course venues >:D ;D ;) ::) :P :-X 8)
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hahaha sure John! Like the Orange frame! This is it!
What about this one? (http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/sethenslow/parker-new-bike-2010.jpg)
Now that is a sweet bike!