Post by: nom de guerre on September 21, 2012, 04:49:53 PM
I am thinking a 125, 200 or 250 would fit well...
You guys into something like this or should I just get rid of it all together? I will have all winter to take this on, plus I have my '12/'13 KTM 125/250 to ride in the meantime.
Lemme know what you think, all input is appreciated, thanks.
Post by: gpnewhouse7 on September 21, 2012, 05:19:54 PM
Aslong as you post build pics up on here.
Post by: motoxr377 on September 21, 2012, 05:30:08 PM
Sounds like you've got the other sizes covered!
Post by: nom de guerre on September 21, 2012, 05:41:10 PM
Post by: Logan Dewey on September 21, 2012, 06:23:29 PM
Post by: msmola2002 on September 21, 2012, 06:51:08 PM
200 is different.
It all comes down not to why, but why not?
Post by: nom de guerre on September 21, 2012, 07:09:06 PM
Post by: gpnewhouse7 on September 21, 2012, 07:50:19 PM
Post by: nom de guerre on September 21, 2012, 08:09:28 PM
Post by: cnrcpla on September 21, 2012, 08:12:44 PM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 22, 2012, 12:45:47 AM
I'm looking forward to the build thread
Post by: scotty dog on September 22, 2012, 01:03:25 PM
Post by: SachsGS on September 22, 2012, 03:11:04 PM
Post by: nom de guerre on September 22, 2012, 05:43:44 PM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 23, 2012, 12:31:21 AM
Post by: nom de guerre on September 23, 2012, 01:09:35 AM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 23, 2012, 01:35:25 AM
) I let my neighbour use my steller stand for what was meant to be a few days until he could get rear tyre replaced. Ended up being over a month of his 250F making me look bad
Post by: TMKIWI on September 24, 2012, 02:36:43 AM
You have the MX bikes covered so might as well go for a nice woods motor.
I have had a KTM200 and they are great engines but for a cheap play bike I would have the KDX engine.
Post by: nom de guerre on September 24, 2012, 03:15:23 AM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 24, 2012, 09:13:26 AM
Post by: 2STROKEREVOLUTION on September 24, 2012, 11:52:24 PM
Is it too late to suggest a KTM 380 motor?!
Post by: 2STROKEREVOLUTION on September 25, 2012, 12:00:47 AM
Good stuff Sachs... I have had a deposit on the Ossa since the day of the press release. Latest info doesn't sound to promising however.... something about GG engines, etc. Maybe the Jota....?
I heard some rumors of GG engines coming out first. Which would ruin the benefit of the Ossa. Jota is questionable on if and when it will be available at this time. Not to mention if it will be any better than what is out there now. Best bet is a current TM or Gas Gas. Both are killer bikes. TM now has KYB forks and their own Works shock and supposedly better motors than KTM. The Gas Gas has legendary handling, great motor, great looks and a trick air filter for 2013.
Post by: nom de guerre on September 25, 2012, 12:25:10 AM
Nope, not too late at all on the 380 suggestion! I had a '98 back in '98 and loved that engine.. Until I find my transplant engine, I am open to possibilities. The Kdx 200 engine would be a great engine for the easy days though....
Post by: 2STROKEREVOLUTION on September 25, 2012, 07:42:34 AM
^^^ yeah, rumour is that the Ossa won't be out any time soon... Kinda rots, but I half expected that when I put the deposit down. Funny thing is, the Explorer model is out now, so I don't know what to think. I will still get one when it comes out(if ever). I love the TM's and the '13's are amazing... I may snag one in spring to book end the KTM. I really like their 300...
Nope, not too late at all on the 380 suggestion! I had a '98 back in '98 and loved that engine.. Until I find my transplant engine, I am open to possibilities. The Kdx 200 engine would be a great engine for the easy days though....
That is strange about Ossa. They showed a complete bike like a year ago and no production expectation. The Explorer, meanwhile, still doesn't have a single real photo on their website, just computer models, yet people have them and are riding them. Weird. The Ossa Enduro looks sweet. Full Ohlins TTX and semi-Direct Injection.
The KDX 200 would be a great trail motor. Nice and easy. The 380 vibrates more, not making it the best slow trail bike. I just love the power. Torque down low like a 300, and the top end of a 500. It'd be cool to see an awesome KTM engine in a great frame. But, whatever you make will be cool. Can't wait to see pics.
Good luck with the Ossa or TM, both are great. Or there is always the Gas Gas Guillaume! So sexy...
Post by: Coop on September 26, 2012, 01:20:41 PM
Why use the KDX engine? Why not a KTM 200 EXC engine? I understand the KDX would atleast match up brand wise but the KTM engine is a more modern and more powerful/tunable motor.
The KDX is an awesome woods engine. A lot of people bash them. But once you own one and spend some time in the TIGHT woods on one you realized why Jeff Freddette raced them for so many years. Really the worst thing about a KDX is the suspension and that's why the KXDX conversions are so popular on KDX forums.
Post by: SachsGS on September 26, 2012, 03:34:48 PM
There is an Ossa Esplorer for sale on Ebay.
Ditch the 380 and wedge a 620 Maico powerplant in there.
Post by: Coop on September 27, 2012, 02:22:02 AM
The KDXs were very nice bikes but they were built to a price - lower spec brakes and suspension etc..
Exactly, that's why I said KXDX conversions are so popular. You use the great engine in a better chassis. I was going to build one from mine and then I ended up selling it first.
Post by: Stusmoke on September 27, 2012, 02:37:53 AM
I still definitely want to see this bike though. Make a new build thread
The KDXs were very nice bikes but they were built to a price - lower spec brakes and suspension etc..
There is an Ossa Esplorer for sale on Ebay.
Ditch the 380 and wedge a 620 Maico powerplant in there.
THAT would be indeed interesting. 620 good god thats crazy.
Hey a quick and really unrelated question that I have: Why do the 250 smokers only make power up to roughly 9000 RPM but keep on revving until 13 grand? Not meaning to thread steal here just a random question I had that seemed silly to make a new thread over.
Post by: cnrcpla on September 27, 2012, 03:04:03 AM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 27, 2012, 03:09:41 AM
I don't think a 250 2T can hit 13k rpms. I could be wrong, but I believe the max is about 11k if your pushing a really modified motor if your lucky. They usually top out at about 9-10k depending on the year/make/model. 125's can push 13k I believe, but those suckers rev.
Ok my bad, but what makes them just stop producing power? It seems pretty silly. The 2013 SX250 literally makes zero horsepower after 9800 or something
Post by: cnrcpla on September 27, 2012, 03:18:10 AM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 27, 2012, 04:03:26 AM
Post by: TMKIWI on September 27, 2012, 04:37:10 AM
In a MX bike you want tractable power so motor is designed to only rev to 9k.
Put the same engine in a road racer or kart with different port timing and you will pull alot more revs and have alot more power.
It just moves the horsepower curve up the rev range which is not suitable for dirt bikes.
Post by: Stusmoke on September 27, 2012, 08:17:00 AM
All to do with port timing stu.
In a MX bike you want tractable power so motor is designed to only rev to 9k.
Put the same engine in a road racer or kart with different port timing and you will pull alot more revs and have alot more power.
It just moves the horsepower curve up the rev range which is not suitable for dirt bikes.
I was just going to mention that if it was a blowing up issue why can the super bikes rev up to 18 grand. Thanks
Post by: cnrcpla on September 27, 2012, 11:57:11 AM
Post by: msmola2002 on September 27, 2012, 12:55:34 PM
Post by: Stusmoke on September 28, 2012, 12:56:21 AM
If you were hitting 14k on a motocross bike wouldn't you be changing piston rings before every race? Not sure, but my logic is more rpms = faster engine wear then running less rpms.
Yes I know but motoGP bikes would undoubtedly be rebuilt after every race at those insane RPMs.
Post by: cnrcpla on September 28, 2012, 01:31:19 AM
Anyways, back on topic. Have you seen any nice KDX engines rearing their head? They seem like a fairly common bike, so an engine shouldn't be to hard to come by.
Post by: nom de guerre on September 28, 2012, 02:05:14 PM
Post by: cnrcpla on September 28, 2012, 04:33:46 PM
Post by: 2STROKEREVOLUTION on September 29, 2012, 07:49:21 PM
Hey a quick and really unrelated question that I have: Why do the 250 smokers only make power up to roughly 9000 RPM but keep on revving until 13 grand? Not meaning to thread steal here just a random question I had that seemed silly to make a new thread over.
There are a lot of factors. As some have said, ridability is a major factor. I saw a custom streetbike with a KTM 250 motor pushing near 90hp. But that powerband would never hook up in the dirt. Second, 4-strokes have very short strokes compared to 2-strokes. This allows them to rev quicker since the piston doesn't have to move as far. Third, reliability, more rpm, more wear and higher stress on parts. Fourth, you need torque and rpm to produce power, if your motor can't breath at higher rpm torque drops off. At some point, torque drops off faster than rpm so your power falls off. Modifying the porting will move your torque up in the rpm range and you will be able to get more power up there, but you will sacrifice bottom end, and that leads to the bad ridability for dirt bikes. So I think you get it, you pick a balance between all the factors for your type of use.