Two Stroke Motocross
Two Stroke Motocross Forum => General Two Stroke Talk => Topic started by: RM250 Evan on December 18, 2010, 12:23:51 AM
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Hey I been thinking about why Yamaha, Suzuki, and Kawasaki still producing 2 strokes but refuse to update them. Are they just running the left over stock out? Did they really produce that many 2 stroke bikes/parts in 08 that they still have left overs even to 2011? Or do they have extra machines and know how to make them so efficiently, so they r just producing the same models over and over to make a little extra dough w/ no really labor needed?
It just got me really thinking for simple stuff like.... why Suzuki doesn't just throw on the RMZ wave rotors on the RM's. R they still producing the plain rotors or just a lot left over?
I made this in MS paint:
(http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq159/volwrath25/2012RM250.jpg)
http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq159/volwrath25/2012RM250.jpg (http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq159/volwrath25/2012RM250.jpg)
To me it would be so easy for Suzuki to produce this RM and sell it w/ little to no effort. All they need to do is make a new subframe/airbox, update the suspension, a little motor update, and the rest will bolt straight up from the RMZ's. Like..
-Brakes/Rotor's
-Fenders
-Number plates
-Graphics
-Seat
-Controls
-Foot pegs
-And any other non motor/frame updates they have
A boy can only dream.... ::)
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Well if there's anything you can say positive about Honda at least they've made their intentions plain, we're finished with 2-strokes, not interested any more, won't be any development, no longer exist as far as we're concerned.
The others (and sadly I increasingly see KTM in this group) are still happy enough to take the 2-stroke money but you don't feel are really committed to the principle, just do enough to get a bike onto the market and would probably drop the strokers completely if economically viable.
I WILL be buying a modern 2-stroke this coming year and as it stands at the minute, I feel it will be a choice between TM and Gas Gas with the new Maico as another possibility depending on how it turns out.
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as of current there is no word of 2011 RM's being imported to australia. they have been selling the 2010's over here for the same price that they were selling in 2001 but you just dont see that many around. maybe having the 250 vs 250 class may see a few more sold but i cant see 125's selling at all because they really arent that competitive anymore.
also with the prices they are selling at it would be hard to imagine they are making that much profit and if the 4 strokes are more profitable to sell than that is what they will stock. with the limited numbers of late model two stroke bikes around one would think that the manufacturers did have that many left over and are just clearing warehouses. when ricky and bubba and reed went to a four stroke the two stroke market died in the ass so there probably is a lot of unsold stock.
there does seem to be a resurgence in the two stoke market again and hopefully companies like suzuki and kawasaki dont pull out completely before it gets a chance to fully take off. by yamaha and ktm staying in the game it is giving some options of staying on two strokes but with limited development they may never take off again.
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Converting any aluminium framed 4T $hitter into a 2T bike is pretty easy most just need new bottom engine mounts welded on and the Y join in the frame lifted.
Don't wait.
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^ But I highly doubt AF conversions are any better than stock 2 strokes. Or atleast not better than a RM250 :P
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Who cares about what the Japs do anyway? Have a look at the 2011 KTMs, very different to my 08, ie new frame, new shock, new bodywork,new exhaust, latest forks. A very up to date and modern bike. So when people say there's no development, I'm guessing they're talking about DFI
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Who cares about what the Japs do anyway? Have a look at the 2011 KTMs, very different to my 08, ie new frame, new shock, new bodywork,new exhaust, latest forks. A very up to date and modern bike. So when people say there's no development, I'm guessing they're talking about DFI
after riding a few older ktm's, 05 and such, i feel that they were behind the japs to begin with and now with their updates they seem to be only catching up now. even the latest review of i think it was the 08 yz, rm and sx the sx seemed to lag behind the other two.
having said that i havent ridden the 2011 sx but i could imagine they are a step ahead
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They havent added linkage to their two strokes though have they?
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They havent added linkage to their two strokes though have they?
Where does it say linkage is better? Americans like Japanese bikes in Europe you only see ktm's.
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No linkage is one reason I like KTM's. I am all about less maintenance. I really wanted a KTM200 when I bought my KDX, I just couldn't afford one.
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I add grease fittings to my linkage bikes to reduce maintenance times.Non linkage bikes try to hydraulically mimic the mechanical rate rise of linkage bikes.I don't think they are there yet.
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They havent added linkage to their two strokes though have they?
Where does it say linkage is better? Americans like Japanese bikes in Europe you only see ktm's.
I didn't say they were better I was just wondering, due to the fact that they put linkage on some four strokes :D
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They havent added linkage to their two strokes though have they?
It was said that the 2st didn't need the linkage. as it suits its power delivery as is.
And lets face it, how many titles has that non linkage chassis won already ? Cant be that bad then can it ;D
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A linkage is a step backwards (its been around for years) the PDS seems to work everywhere else
except in the USA
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Does it not seem coincidental that Roger Decoster arrives at KTM at about the same time the 4 str's are converted to linkage suspensions? As well, I've heard rumors of a couple of Pro's jumping ship and going to KTM as these changes are coming about.
The advantages of the PDS system are lowered manufacturing costs,lighter weight and a less obstructed intake.
The concept of the PDS system in two shock form predates linkage suspensions.
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Does it not seem coincidental that Roger Decoster arrives at KTM
It was Stefan Everts arrival that made them change.
He insisted on it
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I couldn't be happier with my 2011 KTM 250SX. I didn't want an enduro, but a bare bones mx/sx bike. KTM IMO is the only option. The Yamaha is a great bike, but they are getting long in the tooth. If you are willing to settle for something that dates back to 2005, you can buy any of the big 4's used bikes. But if you want "updates" it's either KTM or something very specialized like TM/Service Honda.
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KTMs had linkage suspension up until 97 changing to PDS in 98,
therefore 4st KTMs are going back to linkage suspension, it's not a new idea for KTM
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These companies should make them again and with care. Look at the endurocross races... a 2 stroke wins almost every time. Nice and light with instant power for hopping over stuff. Thanks Taddy Blazusiak! Go KTM for still producing.
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Thanks Graham. I didn't know that. I was too young to pay attention in 98 :)